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Thats an interesting one.

Charles and Maria are both in the school on 1881 and it says they are each other nearest living relation on the registers. They are the only 2 Butlers at the school so presumably they are siblings.

You said they entered the school 25 jan 1878. Is that for
both of them or just Maria? I'm just concerned they're not siblings.

Rose

both of them were admitted together. They were discharged at different dates probably because he was older.

could you find the one that Christine found but in 1861 as then it may give the sons name that made ELizabeth a widow.

I've found them in 1861, children all transcribed wrong, but there is no William Butler. Someone has actually corrected the children's names as they have been researching this family.

I've been thinking about her giving the name William as father and it's possible she didn't really know her father's name as she was put into the home at such a young age.

Have you found Charles in later years and his marriage?

1861 England Census
about Eliza Butler
Name: Eliza Butler
Age: 40
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1821
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: John
Gender: Female
Where born: Shadwell, Middlesex, England

Civil Parish: St George in The East
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View Image

Registration district: St George In The East
Sub registration district: St Paul
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 215
Household Members: Name Age
Agness Amelia 8
Alfred Amelia 4
Emma Amelia 1
Eliza Butler 40
John Butler 40
Hanh Julian 12
John Julian 13
Reuben Julian 18

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 280; Folio: 67; Page: 37

Christine

Thanks Christine.
This is the only one I have really been stuck on. Thought of every combination including that her fathers name may just be imagined to cover up her illegitimacy.
I did do a few searches for Charles after he left the school but to many Charles Butler to be sure none of which says born Woolwich. Very diffficult as you only get half an hour at the library.
Tried searching for a possible death for their mother or if they were born with a different surname and then the mother married.
Very disappointed that the registers at the school didnt show anything
I even contacted the Butler society but they couldnt help.

I just found a marriage of an Elizabeth Ann Butler to a William HIlls Dec 1870 so that would be after the children were born with the surname Butler and then they would say fathers name William!!!!! But the marriage is at Woolwich.
So could you look to see if in 1871 Charles and Maria are with William and Elizabeth Hills with the surname Hills,
Thank you
Gloria
(this is my last shot)
LOL

morning LL
the only William & Elizabeth Hills I can find in the 1871 in the Woolwich area are much older with families. don't seem to fit with what you are after.

I haven't come across this situation before and I really don't know where you go from here

But I do wish you all the best with it

Christine

Thanks for looking for me.
I think I have probably exhausted this one. Unless something shows up in the 1911 census. In an ideal world she would have her mother sleeping over on census night...lol

You could take a look at all the Marias born in Woolwich in 1869-1870 and try and account for them. You could also try cross referencing those births with births for Charles and see if there are any common surnames.

Rose