Find Ancestors

May as well post things twice ...

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1176400

Anthony = ArthurSleep

Just for info.

"Normally do this myself but was in a rush and new i could rely on you all."

Not so's I've noticed.

The only other child i have been told about is Frederick born in Ellens first marriage to Mr Lee this is thought to be c 1906 i have this a possibly in Bradford Yorkshire but again unsure. but its only 4miles from Shipley Yorkshire which isnt impossible.
Why would she put her name down as Cockerill & Single on 1911 census, then have Albert E Lee in 1915?? Every step forward i take on this side of my tree is realy a step sideways & backwards.

I will send for the cert on this one because i have exhausted all other options.

Just a thought that there is quite a gap between Fred and Alfred - do you know of any children between 1907 - 1914?

I would definately send for Albert lee's birth certificate,that seems the only way to find out about his mum and possibly who his dad were.

Maryb.

Ok i am back with some info.
I have asked for further info from the living relative but i am still under the impression that Ellen E.Cockeril married Mr Lee - dont know when.

So i have puchased the 1911 transcript, for both Slater Lee & John William Clunas.
So it shows John William Clunas has a wife aged 26 ( b c1885 ) born in Thornton Le Dale they have 4 children none of which are called Frederick or Albert. Thornton Le Dale is 53 miles from Richmond North Yorkshire where my Ellen E Cockerill was born in 1889 - So this is not my Ellen.

The 1911 Slater Lee census shows he has a wife Edith Lee ( Davidson from marriage register ) aged 28 so born c 1883 in Halifax they have 3 children none of which are Frederick & Albert - So this is not my Ellen either. So again i am snookered, so which Lee did my Ellen Elizabeth Marry or did she just take the name Lee eg never married the father properly????
I have search FreeBMD & Family Search and cant find another marriage.
The 1911 census from Ellen Elizabeth Cockerill shows her in Service in Shipley as Cockerill & Single so I am again Stuck> I know she had Albert E Lee In Richmond North Yorkshire 1915 maiden name on his birth register is cockerill.

Well that still confuses the issue . Which Lee did Ellen Elizabeth Cockerill marry then ??

Found him,its down to the useless transcribers again.
I searched just his first name Slater and it came up with Slater Moore born @ 1882 Calverley.
1891 Original view he is at 25,Kirkham St Rodley.
Thomas Lee 39 married born Calverley
Mary A 39 born Rodley
Annie 16
Joseph 14
Sarah12
Slater 9
At 23 Kirkham St Hannah Greenwood
Ann E Greenwood 33
Mary A Moore neice 50 the transcribers just carried the name Moore to next family but shoud have been Lee.
1901 25,Kirkham St
Thomas Lee
Mary A
Annie
joseph
Lee Lee on original view Slater age 19 born @ 1882.
Elsie Slater neice age 9.
Next door to them now are Elizabeth Slater born rodley unmarried so i think this is Slater's auntie.
Now we just have to crack the other problem.

Maryb

The amount of times the transcibers get it wrong is unbelievable and most annoying.

Well I have have tried every which way and cannot find Slater Lee on 1891-1901 census,I have found info on Edith Davison who he seems to have married.

Maryb

Fred Lee 1906 Bramley is not yours.
1911 census

Herbert Lee 27 Bramley occ forgeman labourer
Bertha Lee wife 25 Bramley married 5 years
Fred Lee 4 Bramley
Earnest Lee 2 month Bramley
Elizabeth Lee month( thats all it says) Bramley

Address 155 Town St Bramley Leeds.

Im thinking there wasnt a marriage to Mr Lee

Heres the 1911 Lee family.

Squire Lee 1869 Holbeck Leeds occ estate labourer.
Ellen Elizabeth 1880 Burnley married 11 years
William 1901 Leeds Holbeck
Herbert 1904 Leeds Churwell
Lillian 1907 Harrogate Pannal

address 25 Spring Terrace Oatlands Harrogate

marriage
Squire Lee married Ellen Elizabeth Barker 1900 mar qt Holbeck 9b 391

Will ask . I wont get the answer tonite so will get back to you.

Anthony

Hi Anthony do you know when Ellen Minnican died,at least then you can narrow down her birth year.
These problems are always annoying,but the answers are out there somewhere.
There is a Ellen Elizabeth Lee born about 1880 on the 1911 census in knaresborough,but I have just used my last credit on Slater lee,typical.

Maryb

ok i see that.

but will you agree its is odd?
Since i am speaking to a living person who says the record are wrong.

Anthony

The only way to resolve this conundrum is to purchase certificates.

Only by checking documentation can you actually 'know' anything - sad, but true. And even then, if the people concerned told untruths, there may still be an element of doubt.

ok see this

Surname First name(s) Mother District Vol Page

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1918 (>99%)
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Minnican Thomas W L Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1101

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Births Dec 1919 (>99%)
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Minnican Vera I Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1317

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Births Jun 1922 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnican Joan Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1302
Minnican Norma Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1302

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1923 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnican Ella Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1195

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1927 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnican Raymond Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1060

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1931 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnican Derick Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1033


Then i see this

Marriages Dec 1917 (64%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Minnican Thomas Lee Richmond Y. 9d 1331

Then i see this

Marriages Sep 1905 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Clunas John William Knaresbro' 9a 171
Cockerill Ellen Knaresbro' 9a 171
DAVISON Edith Knaresbro' 9a 171
Lee Slater Knaresbro' 9a 171

Then i see this

Births Jun 1915 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lee Albert E Cockerill Richmond Y. 9d 1317

So again i am confused

Well i guess i am now very confused!

Could it be that their is some strange goings on in that area at the time!

I dont know how else to explain it

Anthony

Ihave checked the only slater lee on 1911 census .
Slater lee born Calverley 1882 a warehouseman with wife Edith born Halifax 1883 married 5 years. with them are Lawrence Reginald 1906
Stewart 1908 and Monica 1910.

The address is 4,Westover Terrace
Bramley.

Maryb

Maryb

Sorry my eyes gave up. I know that the sisters all went into service around shipley at mid teens. I know that Ellen Elizabeth Cockerill married Slater Lee, due to the family connection and info. I am not sure Slater Lee was in the army & died it was just an assumption because Ellen had Albert Edward Lee 1915 in Richmond also when i checked the national archives is showed a number of S.Lee in Various York Regiments that had died in WW1 alsoEllen then remarried as Ellen Lee to Thomas Minnican in 1917Richmond then went on to have a number of children as i have prevously posted on this thread. All children have mothers maiden name Cockerill, and i am in contact with a relation of Derek Minnican b1931 - that is where the info is comming from he was half brother to Frederick born c1906 an Albert Edward Lee born 1915. He cannot remember much about Frederick because he was 25 yrs younger than him. which is why i raised this thread in the first place.And yes Slater lee appears to be born in Bradford 1881

Ellen Elizabeth Cockerill registered dec 1889 in richmond making her about 15 if she married 1905.
Ellen Cockerill born Pickering North yorkshire 1885,so this could be the one who married John William Clunas in 1905 in Knaresborough.

Maryb

Births Dec 1881 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lee Slater Bradford Y 9b 239