Find Ancestors

Fairthorn, I have done all this (e.g. looked for siblings, there being none) and I have sent Carmen reams of information, including, as I said above, current contact details. It's also been discussed in three separate threads now. (Last summer I found the info that put her in touch with her father's son, but he did not have any info about Carmen's brother.)

Carmen neeeds to get the certificates I referred to in order to ascertain whether one of the AJHs in question is likely to be hers, before going any further herself or asking anyone else to do anything else. She has advised me that she will be doing that and will provide me with the details privately and I will see what else might be done then.

See also here:

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1227478

(deleted below, double posted)

Carmen -- I've sent contact info for one of the children of that marriage. I've also sent info about a possible match for Audrey J on the electoral roll up to 2005 (which unfortunately suggests that she died in 2006) and the names of the people in her household, so you can request an electoral roll from Tracey (I gave directions for doing that).

But *until* you have the certificates I've listed above, and have good reason to think that is your Audrey (if that turns out to be the case), you don't want to be contacting anybody, just on this kind of speculation.

I'll just reiterate -- you need to get the birth certificates for the two possible Audrey J Hawthorn births, and the marriage certificate in question. They will give you

(1) the full names (including middle names, not just initials)
(2) the exact dates of birth (on the birth certificates)
(3) the full name, age and father's name of the one who married in 1949

Both of those pieces of information are needed for searching to see whether there is a death that matches one of those people, and for seeing whether the name of either matches the name you were told.

Unless you get that information, all we're doing is speculating and that is kind of pointless.

Carmen, see my post on page 2, 25th June 2010 23:44.

I sent you all the info about that marriage & children by private message on October 6.

Apologies for the delay in replying.. we have located my half brother Antonio - but he had a different mother to me so that part of it hasnt shed any light at all.

Was the Harlow marriage you found to a Chamberlin?

I knew as a child from my social worker (as I was fostered from 2 years old and put into care for 3months old) that my mother was called Audrey Jean Hawthorn.

Kind regards.

Here we are then, Carmen!

My understanding was that what I found earlier put you in touch with your (half?) brother Antonio Jr, whose mother had remarried.

So the idea is that he wouldn't know about your mother, I guess? And you're still looking for her.

Without reviewing what's in the thread already ... there are two Audrey J Hawthorn births in the 20s, 1922 in Poplar and 1927 in Birkenhead (the one you're referring to). The Poplar birth seems more likely, by location?

Neither of them had siblings (no other births with the same parents' surnames).

There is one marriage for that name, 1949 in Harlow, Essex. That Audrey also used the surname of her husband when she married. There is no death of an Audrey J with that surname up to 2005, and no remarriage in that name.

I'll send you those birth and marriage details privately. There were numerous births to that marriage, before and after 1950, so it may seem unlikely (I'll send them too).

Can you explain why you have the name Hawthorn for your mother?


The best thing I can suggest is to get the birth certificates for both the AJH births in the 20s, to get the full name and exact date of birth for each. The deaths index after 1969 can be searched by given names and date of birth alone, so if Audrey was using another surname when she died, it could be possible to find her death that way (assuming she would have died by 2005, which isn't necessarily the case).

Need a bit extra help on some more of my family history - I was born Carmen Jiminez, and I am trying to find my Mother Audrey Jean - I believe her surname could of been Hawthorn, but on my birth certificate she called herself Audrey Jean Jiminez, although she was not married to my Father Antonio Jiminez.
Her address on my birth certificate was 35, Fernhead Road, Paddington. W.9.
I was born on the 11th Sept., 1950.
I am not sure when my Mother was born, although I found someone of that name born in 1927, Volume 8a Page 756. but am not sure if that was her. I was born in Paddington,London

Please can you help me .

Many Thanks.

I'm kinda confused now, but the info I sent Kate for Carmen did the trick, and Carmen's in touch with her brother now. (I suggested trying Facebook, and sure enough, one of the younger generation was there.)

Kate/Carmen, I'm not sure what the search for Audrey Hawthorn is about. I think I gave you what info there is in this thread -- there are two possibles, with one having married and no trace that I could see of the other (although it's not possible to be certain which is which without the birth certificates and marriage certificate to match the fathers).

Sorry, all the information I received yesterday was new to me nothing I had been told before.

Can anyone help with tracing records for an Audrey j hawthorn born around 1920's.. We have now found out she is a completely separate person to Ada Noble. Any marriage of offspring records. Kind regards.

Kind

You were sent all the info before and I sent you ER results too

You still have your other thread on the go. Please stop posting twice as it does and has had people looking all over again, for information you have all ready been given

I live in Harlow if you need and info on roads or anything.I also had a teacher back in the 1960's at school called Mrs Jimenez.She taught French? That was in Forest Gate and not far from Poplar. Annie

Brillant thank you!!

I am very certain that I have found the right people.

Kate, take the names I gave you in my PM -- Antonio and his children -- and ask GR member "Whirley" for a lookup on the electoral roll.

Copy and paste this into your address line:

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/contact.asp?wci=messagenew&contact_key=2416966

That will open the form for sending her a message directly. You can tell her I sent you!

For the sons at least (I haven't looked for the daughter's marriage, but I can do if you need it), they are on the current electoral roll, so with luck you will be able to get addresses and maybe phone numbers for them, at least.

Now say Wow! ;)

Possibly of interest.

Name: Ada Emily A Alwin
Birth Date: 13 May 1930
Death Registration Month/Year: Oct 2000
Age at death (estimated): 70
Registration district: Chelmsford
Inferred County: Essex
Register number: A66G
District and Subdistrict: 4681A
Entry number: 269

Birthdate matches Ada E A Noble.

Name: Ada E A Alwin
Spouse : Peter J Alwin
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1972
Registration district: Kensington
Registration county (inferred): Middlesex
Volume Number: 5c
Page Number: 1490

The bride seems to have married under her "known as" name. There is no birth of a Ada E A Alwin.

Could that be Ada??

There is a birth later in the year of the marriage that looks a lot like it must be that couple's. Or a grandchild?

A grandchild!

Oh, I think I may have an answer.

I think that IS Ada and I think your Antonio Jr. took his stepfather's surname.

I'm going to PM you what could just be his marriage.

In the index for the 1958 marriage, she is recorded as

Ada E A Noble
and
Jinimez Ada E A Jimenez

I checked the image, and Ancestry has messed that up, of course. It's

JIMENEZ, Ada A E marrying JIMINEZ
not
Jinimez Ada E A Jimenez

There's only one Ada E A Noble marriage, and one birth:

Births Jun 1930
Noble Ada E A (Lawrence) Kensington 1a 228

and no death in that name (unless she didn't marry and died long after when full names were included in records, or is still living).

couple of things

What are the exact details on Carman's birth cert, ie parent's names

Exact details from the marriage cert of Ada/Audrey in 1957, father's name, occupation etc????

Antonio's address at time of death..maybe possible to check electoral roll to see who was living with him.
Is it possible to see if there was a will...perhaps the son Antonio was mentioned??

I take it that Ann has not been able to provide any more info.
is anyone in contact with the Spanish relatives?

Thank you.

Audrey J Hawthorn was born 1922 and married in 1949:

Name: Arthur J Chamberlin
Spouse Surname: Chamberlin Or Hawthorn
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1949
Registration district: Harlow
Registration county (inferred): Essex
Volume Number: 5f
Page Number: 1238

They had children 1949-1963. I doubt that this was the person in question.

The other Audrey J Hawthorn was born 1927 and I don't seen any confirmable marriage or death for her.

But I also don't understand where that name has come from!

We have since traced Ann .. No my mother never lived with them.. She was fostered from a baby

Ginny did send info privately about the niece Ann.

I thought it rather unwise to post her name and personal info at the time, as she is undoubtedly still living, and still do.

Evidently Carmen lost touch with her father as she was not aware of his death info until I provided the registration details. So at some point she (and her brother?) were not living with her father. Were they living with her mother?

Is the mother deceased, and do you know where and when?