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DO take care though with info you get from other people's trees - It 'may' be accurate but it may not !

There are a couple of trees on Ancestry with 'your' Edward in but although the parents match, they have him married to the wrong person with lots of children.

Always check everything out for yourself before accepting it as correct.

It is certainly worthwhile though to make contact with all the name matches you can - you may very well 'strike lucky' !!

Dea x

Another pm from Mary.

Hi Christine.I've become mesmerized! I check back 5,10x per day, soon will unable to when I go back to work 8/16........hoping one of you wonderful people out there can help answer ..why Joseph never lived with either parent...whether his father had indedd been to the US before Joseph was born, and then went back ? to England...why Edward is listed as widower, and if so , when /how did Jane Blackhall die ? sre there any relatives of James Blackhall Alcock (my great uncle ??) alive, etc. etc. I am very thankful for all the wonderful help I've been given and hope to "meet" a real live relative online...in gratitude...Mary

Have you checked the search trees tab at the top to check if anyone else is researching the family?

Someone has Edward in their tree so you could try sending them a message.

Christine

'Possible' marriage for James ??

James B Alcock married Alice Blackburn
Year of Registration: 1914
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Grimsby
County: Humberside, Lincolnshire
Volume: 7a
Page: 1539

Dea x

James B Alcock in 1911


MARSH, Mary Ann Head Widow F 68 1843 Grocer Lincolnshire Caistor VIEW
ALCOCK, James Balckhall Nephew Single M 35 1876 Undertaker And Joiner Lancashire Liverpool VIEW

Registration District:
Grimsby Sub District:
Great Grimsby Enumeration District:
8 Parish:
Great Grimsby

Address:
212 King Edward St Grimsby County:
Lincolnshire

Is this Joseph in America

Joseph W Alcock
Age in 1910: 24
Estimated birth year: abt 1886
Birthplace: England
Relation to Head of House: Lodger
Father's Birth Place: England
Mother's Birth Place: England>>>>>In 1920 he gives Scotland as her place of birth
Home in 1910: Manhattan Ward 12, New York, New York
Marital Status: Single
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1904
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Catherine H Tonyan 64
Elizabeth Tonyan 28
Joseph H Tonyan 31
Joseph W Alcock 24>>>> Carpenter
Charles David 27

I had to go out this morning but have received 2pms from Mary.

I have advised her to reply on the thread.

Pm's received.

Hello Christine..Thank you so much for your quick response ! According to the copy of a birth certificate I have , Edward Alcock was a baker. Sorry if I mis-spoke myself in the original message...Joseph William Alcock, my grandfather, spent his childhood living with his grandparents in Scotland, as far as I know.
The Massachusetts marriage info. is very puzzling to me...the dates make sense, but ...???



Christine ..YES!...this is her ! this is the address on the birth certificate.!..BUT!?..where is Edward ?
This is the first i ever knew for sure that my grandfather had siblings!........ there has always been a family rumor about a brother of his who drowned at sea...was it this James ? a different sibling ? half-sibling ? were there more siblings ? / did they have children ? do we have Alcock relatives ...P.S. how do YOU fit in to all this ? Thank you !!...must sign off now...will keep checking back...how exciting !

She obviously has the birth cert for Joseph and he was born at the address shown for Jane in 1881.

It appears they must have come back to England soon after the marriage as James B was born in Liverpool in 1876.

I still can't find any trace of Edward in 1881.

Christine

Just got in from work and reading through the thread again and wondering why is it that they married in the USA in 1875 and Joseph was born in Liverpool in 1886 and didn't return with them.
Can't locate them in the US after their marriage.

Is this Edward as a widower with his daughter Mary. Travelled over in 1869


Edward Alcock
Age in 1910: 58
Estimated birth year: abt 1852
Birthplace: England
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: England
Mother's Birth Place: England
Home in 1910: Fall River Ward 9, Bristol, Massachusetts
Marital Status: Widowed
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1869
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Edward Alcock 58
Mary Alcock 30
Annie Mann 41
Mornington S Mann 14
Raymond Mann 12



1900


Edward Alcock
Home in 1900: Fall River Ward 9, Bristol, Massachusetts
Age: 48
Birth Date: Oct 1851
Birthplace: England
Race: White
Gender: Male
Immigration Year: 1869
Relationship to Head of House: Head
Father's Birthplace: England
Mother's Birthplace: England
Marital Status: Widowed
Occupation: View on Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Edward Alcock 48
Mary Alcock 20
Henry Alcock 16
Jennie Alcock 12
Annie Mann 31

This could be Matilda's birth. ??? Only Matilda born in Bicker...

Name: Matilda Harrisson
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 10 May 1819
Baptism/Christening Place: BICKER,LINCOLN,ENGLAND
Father's Name: George Harrisson
Mother's Name: Mary:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C02537-1
System Origin: England-ODM
Source Film Number: 421921
Reference Number:
Collection: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975

and these two sibling's of Edward, but not him. Parents Edward and Matilda

Name: William Alcock
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 27 Mar 1848
Baptism/Christening Place: Caistor, Lincoln, England

Name: George Alcock
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 09 Aug 1841
Baptism/Christening Place: Caistor, Lincs, England

possible birth ???

Name: Edward Alcock
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 13 Dec 1815
Baptism/Christening Place: Caistor, Lincs, England
Father's Name: Edward Alcock
Mother's Name: Ann
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C02607-2
System Origin: England-VR
Source Film Number: 1450424
Reference Number: 2:31BP019
Collection: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975

wonderful Dea!!!

So it must have been his married in USA

SSSooo..

This is Edward with his family in 1861:

1861 England Census
about Matilda Allcock
Name: Matilda Allcock
Age: 42
Estimated birth year: abt 1819
Relation: Wife
Spouse's name: Edward
Gender: Female
Where born: Bicker, Lincolnshire, England

Civil parish: Caistor
Ecclesiastical parish: Lincoln
Town: Caistor
County/Island: Lincolnshire
Country: England

Street Address:. 4 Smith St. (Could be South St ???)

Registration district: Caistor
Sub-registration district: Caistor
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 12
Household Members: Name Age
Edward Allcock 46 Master Chair Turner
Matilda Allcock 42
Charles Allcock 16
Henry Allcock 14
William Allcock 13
Thomas Allcock 11
Edward Allcock 9
Louesia Allcock 5
Emma Allcock 3
Elizabeth Allcock 1


All born Caistor, except Matilda who was born in Bicker !!

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 2392; Folio: 55; Page: 3; GSU roll: 542964.

Dea x

Groom's Name: William Blackhall
Bride's Name: Jane Geddes
Marriage Date: 01 Jan 1848
Marriage Place: Speymouth,Moray,Scotland
Bride's Previous Husband's Name:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M11143-4
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 990811
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Marriages, 1561-1910

Name: Isabella Blackhall
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 14 Dec 1852
Baptism/Christening Place: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 06 Dec 1852
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-2
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 990809
Reference Number:
Collection: South Carolina Deaths, 1944-1955

Name: Helen Blackhall
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 20 Apr 1850
Baptism/Christening Place: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 13 Apr 1850
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-2
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 990809
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: Jessie Morrison Blackhall
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 01 Nov 1869
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-3
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: James Geddes Blackhall
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 31 Jul 1858
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-1
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: John Geddes Blackhall
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 06 Jun 1855
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-1
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: Joseph Latten Blackhall
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 10 Jun 1863
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-1
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: Margaret Blackhall
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 01 Apr 1866
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-1
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name: William Blackhall
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date:
Baptism/Christening Place:
Birth Date: 19 Jan 1861
Birthplace: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jean Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-1
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 6035516
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Looks like James went to live with his 'other' grandmother and various aunties and uncles:

1891 England Census
about Jas B Alcock
Name: Jas B Alcock
Age: 15
Estimated birth year: abt 1876
Relation: Nephew
Gender: Male
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Great Grimsby
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
Town: Grimsby
County/Island: Lincolnshire
Country: England

Registration district: Caistor
Sub-registration district: Great Grimsby
ED, institution, or vessel: 11
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Mary A Marsh 48
Matilda Alcock 72
Eliz Alcock 30
Wm Alcock 42
Jas B Alcock 15 Apprentice Joiner.
Wm Hy Milthorpe 54


Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 2613; Folio 125; Page 31; GSU roll: 6097723.

Dea x

Hi Mary,

No relationship.

Was the marriage right? It was only guesswork and also the North Carolina death. Thought I'll throw them in.

Gael

Gael...Thank You.!..this is my ggrandmother...her son, my grandfather Joseph William Alcock, did not live with her or his father, Edward Alcock...apparently J.W. grew up with his maternal grandparents in Scotland..shows up on the census records there as grandson living w/ Wm. Blackhall....no idea where "James Blackhall (Alcock ?) lived ...or what happened to Edward......P.S. now I know her birthdate...and this info. goes w/ Astra's which I had known..pps...are you related toAlcock?

Astra could be right

possible birth ???

Name: Jane Blackhall
Gender: Female
Baptism/Christening Date: 17 May 1848
Baptism/Christening Place: ROTHES,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 10 May 1848
Father's Name: William Blackhall
Mother's Name: Jane Geddes
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11141-2
System Origin: Scotland-ODM
Source Film Number: 990809
Reference Number:
Collection: Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

add: No, wrong birth date

Well Christine, the 1881 you found looks certain to be them:

This would be the James B. shown on there:

ALCOCK James Blackhall West Derby.8b 424 Q2 1876

Dea x

From looking at Lancs Bmd site, I don't think the birth for Joseph which Christine has posted is the correct one,
I think it is more likely to be this one:

ALCOCK Joseph William West Derby.8b 401 Q2 1886
................................................

Lancs Bmd shows:

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1885
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
ALCOCK Joseph Great Crosby South Sefton WAREING C/18/241 (I think this is the one which has been posted)



Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1886
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
ALCOCK Joseph O Kirkdale Liverpool KIRK/52/77
ALCOCK Joseph W Kirkdale Liverpool KIRK/50/45 ***********


Dea x