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Thanks K you must have read my mind. So now I have Hannah's family. Thank you all so much for your efforts.

Thanks Ozibird, that goes o long way to prove my theory! I believe Emma's husband William had died before 1871 as I cannot see any sign of him and that could be why Emma and Samuel are in the workhouse.

Now all I need is Hannah and Emma Webb together in 1841....??

There is this marriage??

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Sep 1860 (>99%)
Hadley Charles Kings N 6c 631
Rudge Mary Ann Kings N 6c 631
>>Wall William Kings N 6c 631
>>Webb Emma Kings N 6c 631

So - If you are correct with the marriage this might be Hannah???
With sister Emma

1851

Name: Hannah Webb
Age: 22
Estimated birth year: abt 1829
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: James Webb
Mother's name: Hannah Webb
Gender: Female
Where born: Birmingham

Civil Parish: Birmingham St George
Town: Birmingham
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image

Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: St George
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 24
Household Members:
Name Age
James Webb 54
Hannah Webb 52
Hannah Webb 22
James Webb 20
Edward Webb 18
William Webb 15
Emma Webb 12

So Hannah was a Webb.

1871 England Census
Name: Emma Wall
Age: 33
Estimated birth year: abt 1838
Relation: Inmate
Gender: Female
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: All Saints
ED, institution, or vessel: Birmingham Workhouse


????
Deaths Sep 1861
Wall Emma Birmingham 6d 94


Too many William Wall deaths in Birmingham between 1860 and 1871 to choose.

There is
1871
Wall Emma 1838 Warwickshire Birmingham, All Saints

Could Emma also be in the workhouse?

Do you know Hannah's surname?

There is this:
Marriages Dec 1860
Davies Margaret Birmingham 6d 235 <<<<<
Painter John Birmingham 6d 235
Tomkins Rosena Birmingham 6d 235
Wall Samuel Birmingham 6d 235 <<<<<

I found John Painter married to a Rosena in 1871.

Thanks Choccy, that is the family and based on the ages of the children I have picked

Marriages Sep 1852
Lloyd John Kings Norton
6c 525

WEBB Hannah Kings Norton
6c 525

I found also
Marriages Sep 1860
Webb Emma Kings N
6c 631

Wall William Kings N
6c 631

as parents for Samuel Wall but needed th 1871 to prove my hunches.

1871 for John

Name: Johns Lloyd
Age: 41
Estimated birth year: abt 1830
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Hanna Lloyd
Gender: Male
Where born: Handsworth, Staffordshire, England
Civil Parish: Aston
Ecclesiastical parish: St Silas
Town: Aston Manor
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Registration district: Aston
Sub-registration district: Erdington
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Household schedule number: 132
Household Members:
Name Age
Johns Lloyd 41
Hanna Lloyd 42
Ellen Lloyd 18
Betsy Lloyd 13
Edward Lloyd 11
John Lloyd 7
Walter Lloyd 5
Kate Lloyd 1

That is just my luck Ozibird - unless you can see his parents in the workhouse as well - lol

1861 census for John Lloyd - his wife is Hannah on original -

1861

LLOYD, John Head Married M 31 1830 Engine Fitter
...
Staffordshire VIEW
LLOYD, Harriet Wife Married F 32 1829
Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW
LLOYD, Ellen Daughter F 7 1854 Scholar
...
Staffordshire VIEW
LLOYD, Betsy Daughter F 3 1858
London... VIEW
LLOYD, Edward Son M 0 (11M) 1861
Birmingham
Warwickshire VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG09 Piece:
2163 Folio:
46 Page:
28

Registration District:
Birmingham Sub District:
8 St George Enumeration District:
42 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Matthias

Civil Parish:
Birmingham Municipal Borough:
Birmingham Address:
Back Of 33, Brearley Street West, Birmingham County:
Warwickshire

1871 England Census
Name: Samuel S Wall [I think it is actually Samuel J on image.]
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: abt 1863
Relation: Inmate
Gender: Male
Where born: Birmingham, Warwickshire, England
Civil Parish: Birmingham
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Registration district: Birmingham
Sub-registration district: All Saints
ED, institution, or vessel: Birmingham Workhouse

Yes K. The Lloyd family are my main interest but I am unable to pinpoint either John or Hannah and think the link to Samuel Wall might be the key.

Based on the 1881 cencus you posted you are looking for Samuel not James?

Hi K. I did see Samuel James being born at the right time but he is not carrying a second name in 1881. Also census ages can be remarkably changeabe over the decades!

So was he actually Samuel James?


Name: Samuel James Wall
Year of Registration: 1862
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Birmingham (1837-1924)
County: Warwickshire
Volume: 6d
Page: 171

Sorry to go missing for so long.

James Wall appears as a nephew in 1881 and I was hoping that finding him in 1871 might explain why he is a nephew?

1881 Census
John LLOYD
Head M Male 51 Birm, Warwick, England Engine Fitter
Hannah LLOYD
Wife M Female 52 Birm, Warwick, England
Bessey LLOYD
Dau Female 23 London, London, Middlesex, England Electroplate Burnisher
Edward LLOYD
Son Male 20 Birm, Warwick, England Printer
John LLOYD
Son Male 18 Birm, Warwick, England Silversmith
Walter J. LLOYD
Son Male 15 Birm, Warwick, England Silversmith
Kate LLOYD
Dau Female 11 Birm, Warwick, England Scholar
Samuel WALL
Nephew Male 18 Birm, Warwick, England Silversmith
Dwelling: 26 Lower Wilton Street, Erdington, Aston, Warwick

I can't see Charles post 61 but this is 51 could be why he met Sarah in Herefordshire Edit - listed as a groom

Name: Charles Wall
Age: 21
Estimated birth year: abt 1830
Relation: Servant
Gender: Male
Where born: Worcester, Worcestershire, England

Civil Parish: Leominster
Town: Leominster
County/Island: Herefordshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image

Registration district: Leominster
Sub-registration district: Leominster
ED, institution, or vessel: 7d
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 5
Household Members:
Name Age

Mary Jane Davies 26
Maria Davies 21
Sarah Davies 37
Susan Sassey 19
Charles Wall 21

Good find - I have been trying all kind of combinations

I think you're right, K, and I think this might be the same family:
1861 census
153 Moseley Rd., Aston, Birmingham
Charles Wall, head, 31, cab driver, born Worcester
Sarah, wife, 31, born Hereford
Charles, son, 9, born Birmingham
Sarah, dau, 7, born "
Thomas, son, 1, born "
Ann, mother, widow, 69, born Herefordshire

On the 71 census Sarah was born Hereford.