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Hi Everyone,
in the 1891 census Frances Warren is grandmother to Joseph Norris b.1872 and Harry Norris b.1878. Joseph is my grandfather. Frances also has a son, Ben Warren b. 1866 and a grandnephew Frank Holmes b. 1880. In 1891 Francis is a widow and all are living at the same address in east Huddersfield. Joseph's Grandfather is Thomas Norris b. 1804 Leeds, tailor, wife unknown. Joseph's parents are Thomas Norris 1842-1885 and Mary Ann Dyson b. 1845. I've hit a brick wall in trying to trace Frances' relationship to the Norris', Dysons and Holmes. Can anyone help with information about Frances or Thomas Norris b. 1804?

For reference

1881


Thomas NORRIS Head M Male 39 Huddersfield, York, England Cotton Spinner
Mary Ann NORRIS Wife M Female 36 Huddersfield, York, England
John William NORRIS Son Male 13 Huddersfield, York, England Cotton Piecer
Joseph NORRIS Son Male 9 Huddersfield, York, England Scholar
Harry NORRIS Son Male 3 Huddersfield, York, England
John William NORRIS Nephew Male 16 Huddersfield, York, England Cotton Piecer
Thomas NORRIS Father W Male 77 Leeds, York, England Tailor

:
Dwelling North Building Watergate
Census Place Huddersfield, York, England

birth: 1804 — Leeds, York, England
residence: Huddersfield, York, England

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Thomas Norris
age: 77
gender: Male
birth year: 1804
birthplace: Leeds, York, England
relationship to head of household: Father
marital condition: Widowed
profession / occupation: Tailor
address: North Building Watergate
census place: Huddersfield, York, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1342047
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 4384 / 63
page number:

birth: 1873 — Leeds, York, England
residence: Leeds, York, England
parents: William Norris, Elizabeth Norris

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Joseph Norris
age: 8
gender: Male
birth year: 1873
birthplace: Leeds, York, England
relationship to head of household: Son
profession / occupation: Scholar
address: 9 Napier St
census place: Leeds, York, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1342086
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 4522 / 119
page number:

birth: 1878 — Huddersfield, York, England
residence: Huddersfield, York, England
parents: Thomas Norris, Mary Ann Norris

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Harry Norris
age: 3
gender: Male
birth year: 1878
birthplace: Huddersfield, York, England
relationship to head of household: Son
address: North Building Watergate
census place: Huddersfield, York, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1342047
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 4384 / 63
page number: 23

birth: 1842 — Huddersfield, York, England
residence: Huddersfield, York, England
parents: Thomas Norris
spouse: Mary Ann Norris

record title: England and Wales Census, 1881
name: Thomas Norris
age: 39
gender: Male
birth year: 1842
birthplace: Huddersfield, York, England
relationship to head of household: Head
marital condition: Married
profession / occupation: Cotton Spinner
address: North Building Watergate
census place: Huddersfield, York, England
record type: Household
family history library film: 1342047
the national archives reference: RG11
piece / folio: 4384 / 63
page number: 23

1891 on fmp for reference.

WARNER, Frances Head Widow F 67 1824
Kirkheaton
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Ben Son Single M 25 1866 Dyer
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
NORRIS, Joseph Grandson Single M 19 1872 Cotton Piecer
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
NORRIS, Harry Grandson M 13 1878 Grocers Assistant
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
HOLMES, Frank Grandnephew M 11 1880 Scholar
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
SWEET, George Lodger Married M 46 1845 Tin Plate Worker
Wolverhampton VIEW
RG number:
RG12 Piece:
3570 Folio:
59 Page:
36

Registration District:
Huddersfield Sub District:
Huddersfield Enumeration District:
25 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Marks

Civil Parish:
Huddersfield Municipal Borough:
Huddersfield Address:
15, Rose Street, Huddersfield County:
Yorkshire (West Riding)

Thanks Mike and Anne,I'm hoping to solve the puzzle of Frances Warren's connection to the family. I have pretty good information on Thomas 1804 as a widow , but nothing on any marriage.

Looks like Mary Ann Norris ( nee Dyson) is the illegitimate daughter of Frances Warren (nee Dyson) which makes her Grandmother to May Ann's children.


Mary Ann Dyson --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth:
Christening: 03 AUG 1845 Kirkheaton, Yorkshire, England
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Mother: Frances Dyson

.....................................................................

Can't see a marriage for Dyson/Warren so maybe Frances was married twice.

Who does Mary Ann name as her father on her marriage cert to Thomas Norris ?

Births Mar 1880
HOLMES Frank Huddersfield 9a 366

In 1881 he was a boarder with this family:

1881 England Census
about Frank Holmes
Name: Frank Holmes
Age: 1
Estimated birth year: abt 1880
Relation: Boarder
Gender: Male
Where born: Huddersfield, Yorkshire, England

Civil Parish: Almondbury
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street address: Perseverance St
Education:

Employment status:

View image

Registration district: Huddersfield
Sub-registration district: Almondbury
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Ben Taylor Smith 30
Emma Smith 29
Joseph Smith 4
Mary Challenger 17
Harriet Challenger 14
Frank Holmes 1

1841 England Census
about Frances Dyson
Name: Frances Dyson
Age: 15
Estimated birth year: abt 1826
Gender: Female
Where born: Yorkshire, England

Civil Parish: Kirk Heaton
Hundred: Agbrigg (Upper Division)
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

View image

Registration district: Huddersfield
Sub-registration district: Kirkburton
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
William Dyson 55
Frances Dyson 15
Ann Dyson 15

1871

WARNER, Frances Head F 48 1823 Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Hannah Daughter F 14 1857 Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Ben Son M 5 1866 Yorkshire VIEW
NORRIS, Joseph Lodger M 37 1834 Yorkshire VIEW
SMITH, Charles Lodger M 36 1835 Yorkshire VIEW
RG number:
RG10 Piece:
4369 Folio:
30 Page:
5

Registration District:
Huddersfield Sub District:
Huddersfield Enumeration District:
23 Ecclesiastical Parish:

Civil Parish:
Huddersfield Municipal Borough:
Huddersfield Address:
Dock Street, Huddersfield County:
Yorkshire


1881

WARNER, Frances Head Widow F 51 1830 Baker
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Ben Son Single M 15 1866 Errand Boy
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WOODHOUSE, Hannah Daughter Married F 25 1856 Wife Of Tin Plate Worker
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WOODHOUSE, Andrew Son In Law Married M 23 1858 Tin Plate Worker
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
BROOK, Joseph Lodger Single M 41 1840 Teamer For Timber Merchant
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WOODHOUSE, Frances Ann Grand Daughter Single F 2 1879
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
RG number:
RG11 Piece:
4384 Folio:
66 Page:
29

Registration District:
Huddersfield Sub District:
Huddersfield Enumeration District:
Ecclesiastical Parish:

Civil Parish:
Huddersfield Municipal Borough:
Address:
79, Castle Gate, Huddersfield County:
Yorkshire (West riding)

1901


ARNER, Ben Head Married M 35 1866 Engine Fitter
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Emily Wife Married F 27 1874
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Mary A Daughter Single F 9 1892
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, William Son Single M 6 1895
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Lucy Daughter Single F 5 1896
Manningham
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Harry Son Single M 2 1899
Leeds
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Francis E Daughter Single F 0 (5 MOS) 1901
Leeds
Yorkshire VIEW
HOLMES, Frank Boarder Single M 21 1880 Lead & Glass Warehouseman
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
RG number:
RG13 Piece:
4223 Folio:
34 Page:
23

Registration District:
Leeds Sub District:
North Leeds Enumeration District:
25 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Marys

Civil Parish:
Leeds Municipal Borough:
Address:
8, Grimston Street, Leeds County:
Yorkshire (West riding)


The name appears to be Warner not Warren.

Thanks Alviegal, I'd like to know if Frances was married and what her maiden name was or a previous marriage. I'm stumped as to how she connects to the Norris family.

Christine have you not read my post ?

Frances was Mary Ann Dyson's mother.

I think this one explains the relationship. Remember in law sometimes means stepchild.

WARNER, William Head Married M 41 1820 Agricultural Labourer
Rochdale
Lancashire VIEW
WARNER, Frances Wife Married F 37 1824
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
DYSON, Mary A Daughter In Law Unmarried F 17 1844 Cotton Rover
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, Hannah Daughter F 5 1856 Scholar
Huddersfield
Yorkshire VIEW
WARNER, John J Son M 0 (1M) 1861
Rochdale
Lancashire VIEW
RG number:
RG09 Piece:
3045 Folio:
70 Page:
29

Registration District:
Rochdale Sub District:
7 Wardleworth Enumeration District:
14 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St James

Civil Parish:
Wardleworth Municipal Borough:
Rochdale Address:
8, Ogden Street, Wardleworth, Rochdale County:
Lancashire



Liz

1851 England Census
about Mary A Dyson
Name: Mary A Dyson
Age: 7
Estimated birth year: abt 1844
Relation: Wifes Daur (Step Daughter)
Mother's name: Frances Warner
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Kirkheaton, Yorkshire, England

Civil Parish: Huddersfield
Town: Huddersfield
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image

Registration district: Huddersfield
Sub-registration district: Huddersfield
ED, institution, or vessel: 4
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 61
Household Members:
Name Age
William Warner 31
Frances Warner 28
Sarah Warner 2 MO
John Dyson 3
Mary A Dyson 7

The 1861 census has Mary Ann as Daughter in law but she is unmarried. I think it should read Step-daughter.

England & Wales, FreeBMD Marriage Index: 1837-1915
about William Warner
Name: William Warner
Year of Registration: 1850
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Huddersfield
County: Yorkshire - West Riding, West Yorkshire
Volume: 22
Page: 291
Francis Dyson

FOUND IT .


Frances spelt Francis (the male way)


Marriages Jun 1850 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BATTYE John Huddersfield 22 291
Bray Andrew Huddersfield 22 291
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dyson Francis Huddersfield 22 291
Hinchliffe Ann Huddersfield 22 291
Hinchliffe Elizabeth Huddersfield 22 291
Marshall Hannah Huddersfield 22 291
Thorpe Richard Huddersfield 22 291
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>WARNER William Huddersfield 22 291



Snap MB !

Thankyou, this is great information to work with. You've pointed me on some new paths to research. Now if I can just find out more about Thomas 1804 and his partners.