Find Ancestors

Hi all,

I seem to either have misplaced an ancestor of mine, or am being completely blind and cannot locate him.

Charles Gwennap was born 1882 in St Buryan, Cornwall to Mary Cargeeg and John Gwennap.

The 1901 English Census shows the Gwennap family residing at Crowas, in the Civil Parish of Ludgvan, Cornwall, England.

The household consists of:

Mary (56) Head, Widow, born Morvah, Cornwall
Thomas (27) Son, Copper Miner, Worker, born St Buryan, Cornwall
John (30) (Note states dumb and deformed from infancy) born St Buryan, Cornwall
Henry W (23) Son, Copper Miner, Worker, born St Buryan, Cornwall
Honor P (25) Daughter, born St Buryan, Cornwall
Charles (18) Son, Pupil Teacher in Elementary School, born St Buryan, Cornwall
Robert (17) Son, Farm Labourer, Worker, born Ludgvan, Cornwall
Mary L (15) Daughter, born Ludgvan, Cornwall
Howard (10) Son, born Ludgvan, Cornwall

I have traced the whole family before and after this census and can account for all of them except for Charles.

I can find no matching record of death or of emigration, and in the 1911 census returns he is not residing with any of his siblings.

I’d just like to know what happened to him. A number of his siblings died very young (between 10 and 35) and some in the months just after the 1901 census..perhaps there was an illness, or the living conditions were poor. Perhaps if he went on and became a school teacher he moved somewhere else..but I just can’t see anything.

Could anyone find anything to help please??? (Please don’t waste your time trying to get previous census returns etc, I have all of those and births and deaths etc, so I can supply those if needed).

Thanks everyone

Not a very common name (only 4 births in the GRO index pre-1900) -- what do you think?

South African National Archives


DEPOT KAB
SOURCE MOOC
TYPE LEER
VOLUME_NO 6/9/18751
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 5570/51
PART 1
DESCRIPTION GWENNAP, CHARLES. ESTATE PAPERS.
STARTING 19510000
ENDING 19510000


DEPOT KAB
SOURCE 3/CT
TYPE LEER
VOLUME_NO 4/1/4/431
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE T348/4
PART 1
DESCRIPTION MUNICIPAL PROVISION OF HOMES ORDINANCE: LOAN - C GWENNAP.
STARTING 1923
ENDING 1929


possibly spouse?

DEPOT KAB
SOURCE MOOC
TYPE LEER
VOLUME_NO 6/9/24025
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 3055/56
PART 1
DESCRIPTION GWENNAP, ANNIE MELISSA. NEE COOPER. ESTATE PAPERS.
STARTING 19560000
ENDING 19560000


After much hypothesizing, my theory about my gr-grf's nephew was finally confirmed when a terrific member here did the search at Kew and found his enrolment papers in the Imperial Yeomanry for the Anglo-Boer War. I don't see Charles's name in the IY list

http://www.britishmedals.us/files/iyg.htm

but he could have in a regular military unit, or just travelled to SA himself, possibly as a teacher -- that might be what the provision of homes thing related to.


SA NA:

http://www.national.archives.gov.za/index.htm

click on the left

Search National Automated Archival Information Retrieval System

click

All Archives Repositories and National Registers of non-public records

for starters; that's where I found the results above by searching just for Gwennap.

Is this him ??

passenger transcript details
Name: Chas GWENAPP
Date of departure: 16 February 1910
Port of departure: Southampton
Passenger destination port: New York, USA
Passenger destination: New York, USA

Date of Birth:
Age:
Marital status: Single
Sex: Male
Occupation:
Passenger recorded on: Page 13 of 17




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Ship:
Official Number:
Master's name:
Steamship Line:
Where bound:
Square feet:
Registered tonnage:
Passengers on voyage:
PHILADELPHIA

A R Mills
American Line
New York, USA
11259
10786
487

Well hm!

Are they mutually exclusive do you think, or might he have moved around? ;)

I don't see a good match for a passenger record to SA, so maybe that was what did happen.

The arrival in New York of the Charles Gwennap found by Jax from the Ellis Island site:-

First Name: Charles
Last Name: Gwennap
Ethnicity: British, English
Last Place of Residence: Newlyn, England
Date of Arrival: Feb 24, 1910
Age at Arrival: 41y Gender: M Marital Status: M
Ship of Travel: Philadelphia
Port of Departure: Southampton
Manifest Line Number: 0016



that's a little old for your Charles isn't it??


From image:-


NOT yours


he was a Labourer, going to Braddock, Pennsylvania
Next of Kin- Mrs James Gwennap, Clifton Place, Newlyn, Penzance


site is www.ellisisland. org if you want check


you have to register with the site, but it is free.




sylvia

That does look like one of these - edit, oops, this one - Sylvia:


Births Mar 1870
Gwennap Charles Penzance 5c 343


I wonder whether, if he did go to SA with the military, this might be his bride returning from a trip home?

GWENNAP 1887 F 1916 London South Africa Cape


(Everybody posting at once and we beat Lynne to the button. ;) Lynn -- to avoid all those idiotfaces, just add a space after every colon when you copy and paste.)

Let's try this one???

Name: Mr GWENNEPP
Date of departure: 26 September 1903
Port of departure: Liverpool
Passenger destination port: New York, USA
Passenger destination: New York, USA
Date of Birth:
Age:
Marital status: Single
Sex: Male
Occupation: Mech
Passenger recorded on: Page 6 of 13

Printer friendly version
Click here to view image
Ship:
Official Number:
Master's name:
Steamship Line:
Where bound:
Square feet:
Registered tonnage:
Passengers on voyage:

ETRURIA
Pritchard
New York, USA
9539
3689
528

This one ties in with him being a teacher??

Name: Mr Chas GWINNAP
Date of departure: 13 March 1909
Port of departure: Southampton
Passenger destination port: Cape, South Africa
Passenger destination: Cape, South Africa
Date of Birth:
Age:
Marital status: Single
Sex: Male
Occupation: Schoolmaster
Passenger recorded on: Page 1 of 6

Printer friendly version
Click here to view image
Ship:
Official Number:
Master's name:
Steamship Line:
Where bound:
Square feet:
Registered tonnage:
Passengers on voyage:

BRITON
106119
S C Brown
The Union-Castle Mail Steamship Co. Ltd.
South Africa
5154
162

Um, nobody likes the South African records I found? Right name, a death in 1951 would have made him close to 70 ...


edit -- Oops, Lynne likes it and confirms it!


The bride, perhaps?

Births Jun 1887
Cooper Annie Melissa E Saffron W. 4a 633

Here's Annie Melissa Gwennap returning to the UK from Durban SA



UK Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960

Name: Mrs Annie Melissa Gwennap
Birth Date: abt 1887
Age: 29
Port of Departure: Durban, South Africa
Arrival Date: 11 May 1916
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: East London
[Port Elizabeth]
[Cape Town]
[Plymouth]
Ship Name: Saxon
Search Ship Database: View the 'Saxon' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping line: Union-Castle Mail Steamship Company Ltd
Official Number: 112713


Not much other information on the image ..... country of permanent residence is South Africa, but it doesn't say where she is going in the UK


She's apparently travelling alone ........ but why return to the UK in the middle of WW1?





sylvia

Janey


I liked your SA records, only I don't know how to follow up on them!



sylvia

hmmmm


did Annie Melissa follow him out then, and they got married in SA?


I can't find a marriage in the UK





sylvia

That's what I figured.

COOPER A M Unknown F 1905 Southampton South Africa Cape

?

-- maybe not so much followed him out as went ahead of him, possibly with her own family. (She was from Essex, maybe not likely to have crossed paths in England.) Or perhaps she was a schoolteacher too and travelled to work.

I think more feasible that she went out with her family, or to join family members, or as a servant with someone ........ she'd only be about 18, surely a little young to be travelling by herself at that time?



sylvia

Oh you are all fantastic!

I knew he hadn't gone to the USA or Australia as I had checked Ellis Island and the Australian sites. The family seems to have spilt between America and Australia with the remainder staying in Cornwall.

He did have one brother who kept travelling back and forth to South Africa as a miner, but thank you all so much I would never have found him! (It never occurred to me to check that country, duh )

Janey there was another Charles in his family but he died very young and I assume they named this one after him!

I just couldn't find anything on Ancestry etc.

I have never tried to retrieve anything from the South African archives, I'll give it a try.

Thank you all once again, what legends of searching you are! Take a bow!!!

:D :D :D :P

The midnight genii of GR, that's us! ;)

LOL, all that midnight magic!!!

It is early afternoon here, hence why I don't have any!

Could I please just ask,

When Annie returned to England on the shipping record found by Sylvia in 1916, was she accompanied by anyone or on her own?

I think you are all spot on the money and Annie Melissa is Charle's wife. I had a quick look at a Census and it seems her father was a painter - carpenter and teh family had stayed in the UK, so as suggested perhaps she went out there to be a servant or a teacher herself?

Grace


she was on her own, no-one else with the name Gwennap on board



sylvia

Have you already contacted the OPC (online parish clerk)? And hope you know that all Cornish census are online free, other than the 1911. :-)