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Hi Hazel - Thanks for the update - I suppose you've been taking advantage of Ancestry.ca's Canada Day freebies which last until 5am 3/7/2012 in UK.

A couple of things - firstly on John's attestation - also click to next image to see back of form.
This is always free via:
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/cef/index-e.html

Secondly, on the m.cert, there's 2 witnesses - Jane Broadfoot (Mabel's sis) and the minister's wife.

You can look up Mabel's b.cert:
Mabel Mary Broadfoot b 30/5/1881 d/o William Broadfoot & Mary Smith, Farmer in Concession 4 Lot 6 Nichol Township, Wellington Co. (It's just SE of Fergus)

The only free census on Ancestry is 1871 (free this w/e)
However, most census's are free and gotten by drilling down from the LAC portal:
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/genealogy/index-e.html
to the census index links page:
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/genealogy/022-911.009-e.html
(NB 1861 & 1916 are free but tricky).

I've put Wm & Mabel's censuses below:

I think Isabella is Wm's sis (Wm & Isa are Single), and the Black kids are his nephews? (s/o Thos Black & Margaret Broadfoot):
1861 http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1861/pdf/4108430_00530.pdf
Mary Smith http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1861/pdf/4108430_00607.pdf
[In general, for 1851 & 1861, the census often runs ont multiple pages, but there's no 2nd 1861 page here]

1871 http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1871/pdf/4396297_00533.pdf
(it's easy to find the image, but getting this URL is a bit geeky)
Note Wm is next to John and James, and Jas continues onto next image (so just change last digit in URL)
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1871/pdf/4396297_00534.pdf
John & James are the right ages to be Wm's bros, but they were born in another country, so who knows.
(From their kids mid-names, it looks more likely they are bros).


Here's some more free sites:

Try a look up for Mabel Carey in Canada at:
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gs&

From Mabel's b.cert, we know she was b at Lot 6, Concession 4, Nichol Twp, Wellington Co.
You can look this up at:
http://digital.library.mcgill.ca/countyatlas/SearchMapframes.php
NB The detail maps often lack a compass rose - the top edge of http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1911/pdf/e002027411.pdf
the Nichol map is NW.
These 100 acre lots are 50 x 20 chains (80 chains=1 mile). So we want just SE of Fergus.


http://archive.org/stream/torontodirec192100midiuoft#page/644/mode/1up
http://archive.org/stream/torontodirec192100midiuoft#page/604/mode/1up
[Jane Hastings Broadfoot (Mabel's sis) is the marr witness - 653 Indian is abt 3 km W of Queens Park, and just 300 m W of Symington - Jane was living here when she died]


Now from 1861-1901 the nominal census day in Canada was either the same or the day after the UK's. In 1911 it was 1/6/1911.
Now using AG for census:

1911 Census of Canada
Home / 1911 / Ontario / Toronto North / 60 ward 4 / page 5
22 46 McPhail Isabella 572 Spadina Ave F Head W May 1875 36
23 46 McPhail Hellen G. F Daughter S Aug 1900 11
24 46 McPhail Gladies F Daughter S Jan 1902 9
25 46 McPherson Jon 572 Spadina Ave M Father M Feb 1834 77
26 46 McPherson Helen F Mother M Jun 1848 63
27 46 McPherson Marion F Sister S Jul 1886 25
28 46 Broadfoot Mabel 572 Spadina Ave F Boarder S Mar 1881 30
29 46 Broadfoot Jane H. F Boarder S Sep 1872 39
30 46 Paterson Murray M Boarder S Jul 1887 24
31 46 Gardner Harry M Boarder S Dec 1885 25
32 46 Ryan Norma F Boarder S Jul 1884 26

http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1911/pdf/e002027411.pdf
[Spadina is 400m W of Queens Park]

I don't see John Carey in 1911


1901 Census of Canada Page Information
District: ON WELLINGTON (Centre) (#124)
Subdistrict: Nichol G-1 Page 1
Details: Schedule 1 Microfilm T-6504
42 9 Broadfoot David M Head S Dec 13 1861 40
Subdistrict: Nichol G-1 Page 1
43 10 Broadfoot Walter M Head S Oct 29 1866 34
44 10 Broadfoot William M Father W Dec 25 1823 77
45 10 Broadfoot Jane H F Daughter M Sep 17 1871 23
Subdistrict: Nichol G-4 Page 5
13 50 Broadfort? Thomas B M Head S Nov 25 1876 25
14 50 Broadfort? Isa? F Sister S Mar 8 1878 23
15 50 Broadfort? Mable F Sister S May 29 1882 19
16 50 Smith Allison F Aunt S May 24 1839 61

1901 is the only other census that comes on more than one image. Here Schedule 2 is for the house (& has the address).
The above transcription was from AG, and easily gives the schedule 1 image, and sometimes the schedule 2 via links in the page footers, but not here.

So do a look up at LAC for district=Wellington subdistrict=Nichol at:
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/census-1901/index-e.html

http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1901/z/z003/z000113477.pdf
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1901/z/z005/z000200111.pdf
[P1 L42 addy=Lot 5 Con 4; P1 L43 addy=Lot 6 with part 7 Con 4]
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1901/z/z003/z000113519.pdf
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/1901/z/z005/z000200114.pdf
[P5 L13 addy=Lot 12 Con 14]

You can locate these properties on the McGill concessions map (URL above).

I have him as either John Edwin Carey or John Eldon Carey with varying dates of birth.
The information I have is
1 Jan 1879 John Edwin Carey born
18 Jan 1912 John Eldon Carey married Mabel Mary Broadfoot in Toronto. The details of his parents match those of John Edwin Carey.
19 April 1915 John E Carey Attestation papers for the Canadian Over-Seas Expeditionary Force. D of Birth given as 1.1. 1887
19 Jan 1926 John Eldon Carey, Bachelor, aged 39 and a Butler married Annie Brooker, Widow, aged 41 at Uxbridge Register Office. (She was my maternal grandmother) His Father is given as Alfred John Carey, Doctor of Medicine
23 June 1944 Annie Carey died aged 60 at Tolworth. Wife of John Edwin Carey, School Carketaker
1 Feb 1952 John Edwin Carey died aged 73 at Downside Hospital Eastbourne. He was a Retired Caretaker living at 123 Victoria Drive.
My mother Doris referred to him as Bun but I never knew why, but she did say he was a school caretaker so that fact seems to be correct.

as I said there is a 14-day free trial available

( you need a credit card to register and you need to cancel in time not to be charged )

if you have already used a free trial you can register at ancestry.ca specifically ... and use a different email address ...

Thankyou for the info .unfortunately I can't afford the sub to Ancestory

Seems like it's just on the date I mentioned.

As Chrissie said, periodically Ancestry give free access to a small set of their records. They last gave free access to the Drouin set (along with all their marr records) the week of Kate & Whosit's wedding. They often give access to US military records around Memorial Day (last Monday in May).

sorry chrissie
it was mgnv who said when we next get free access :-)

'when we next get free access' ... I didn't think I said that ... did someone else ?

it's true that Ancestry does offer free access to certain data sets now and then, for example to military records around Nov 11 ...

of course you can always take out a 14-day free trial at ancestry.ca to search records thoroughly

Dear chrissiex- what do you mean when you say when we next get free access.Is there a certain window each year of free access or is it with a subscription to another site?
there was another John E carey he appears on the 1911 census born in Holburn .He is on the 1901 census too married with a son john so he can not be the same as the one that went to canada who appears sinle with his younger brother on the 1901 census.
thanks sue

oops, I saw that it was RC events in Ontario for instance and forgot about old English military marriages and the like in Quebec that are found there ...

now we just need somebody who has access to it at ancestry to take a look :-)

Chrissiex - not quite - the Drouin collection covers ALL denominations in Quebec, but only RC outside Quebec (e.g., Atlantic Canada, N Ontario, NE USA, etc).

Here's some examples from my tree (my dad's aunt & cousin):

Quebec Vital and Church Records (Drouin Collection), 1621-1967
Name: Elizabeth Patterson
Event Year: 1916
Event: Enterrement (Burial)
Religion: Presbyterian
Place of Worship or Institution: Montréal (Presbyterian Calvin)
Province: Québec (Quebec)

Quebec Vital and Church Records (Drouin Collection), 1621-1967
about George Norise Rennie Massie
Name: George Norise Rennie Massie
Spouse: Susannah Minchinton
Event Year: 1921
Event: Mariage (Marriage)
Religion: Anglican
Place of Worship or Institution: Péninsula (Anglican Church)
Province: Québec (Quebec)

Quebec Vital and Church Records (Drouin Collection), 1621-1967
about Charles George Mossie
Name: Charles George Mossie
Event Year: 1922
Event: Naissance (Birth)
Religion: Methodist
Place of Worship or Institution: Cap-aux-Os (Methodist Church)
Province: Québec (Quebec)


Here's my transcription of the first entry:

Elizabeth Patterson wife of Joseph Massie
died at her late residence 57 Brewster St
Montreal on the twenty-third day of
December in the year of our Lord one
thousand nine hundred and sixteen and
was buried in Mount Royal Cemetery
on the twenty-sixth day of the same
month and year in the presence of
the undersigned witnesses.

W.D.Turner
Minister
Joseph Massie
George Massie


I didn't realize that Scottish churches in Quebec would bury wives under their Maiden Surname.
I'm going to have to search again for some rellies when we next get free access (Oct 12th upcoming).

no there is no distinction between languages in vital records, they are by province ... the Drouin collection is a privately created collection for Roman Catholic records in various places ...

No memory of children and those who passed on the memories to me are now in their late 90's, early hundreds. I reckoned to she could have been french canadian- perhaps there is a separate dtabase covering franch marrieages. there might have been something about joining the canadian forces? but I can try and check that out again-it might be wishful thinking on my part

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=7921

Ontario marriages 1801-1928

you can do a free search but not see details

there is no marriage of an Yvonne to a Carey

( also no marriage of a John Carey to a Minnie )

there is one John E Carey marriage ... to Hannah Woodhull ... but it was sometime before 1860 ( I did not try to narrow the dates )

Yvonne could have been French-Canadian ... I once had a French friend named Jean-Yves, which could be pronounced John-Eve ... but my mum always said Johnny Yevs

someone could try a search of the Drouin Collection

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/search/db.aspx?dbid=1091

there are many many John Carey marriages ... a John Ed Carey or two ... but I can't see any details ...


one would think that if he married it was before 1928

is there any memory of children ?

I wonder if he was on the 1911 english census and I missed him . 1901 he was a drapers assistant
can anyone check again for me,thank you.
sue

ok lets recap
He was john Edwin carey birth reg 1q 179 st giles
I have birth date 1st jan 1879,I have baptism3rd august 1879 st Mary Aldermony.
His wife (?) was definately Yvonne, remembered by his still living niece who couldn't pronounce it properly.
As far as I know he stayed in canada but won't rule out that he could have returned to the uk much later.
Were there any marriages listed in Ontario for a john E cary -to anyone.Perhaps yvonne was her known name and not her registered name and therefore wouldn't have featured on a marriage cert.
John was known to the family as Bun - no idea why
thanks sue

interesting that there is also this death in the same place

Name: Minnie H Carey
Birth Date: abt 1880
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1953
Age at Death: 73
Registration district: Eastbourne
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 5h
Page: 371

... but there is no marriage in England/Wales of a Minnie H to a Carey ... and no birth of a Minnie H Carey ...

the birthdates in the Canada census are John Aug 1880 and Minnie Aug 1879 ... but it could still be worth having a look ...


oh and just about that passenger record ... Canada would have wanted farmers ... he may have given that as his intended occupation

I wonder whether he actually went to / stayed in Canada

in England/Wales there are these births for John E Carey from 1876 to 1880

Births Mar 1878
Carey John Edward Q Barnsley 9c 217

Births Mar 1879
Carey John Edwin St. Giles 1b 629


this would be the death of the first one

Name: John E Carey
Birth Date: abt 1878
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1954
Age at Death: 76
Registration district: Sheffield
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume: 2d
Page: 206


then there is also this death which matches the birth date for the second birth

Name: John E Carey
Birth Date: abt 1879
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1952
Age at Death: 73
Registration district: Eastbourne
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 5h
Page: 253

and there is no other birth to match that death

there were no John E Carey births from 1870 to 1878

this birth matches a death in 1943

Births Dec 1882
Carey John Edward Pontypridd 11a 373

and this birth matches a death in 1951

Births Sep 1883
CAREY John Edwin Halifax 9a 413

and the other John E Carey born in 1883 died in infancy

you can search the 1911 Canada census for free and view images here

http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/index.jsp

select Ontario ( but once you have results you can select 'all' )

and search for surname Carey

then filter for given name John ... oh, there are a lot ! ....... but not that one, the transcription must be a problem ...


start over, click on Ontario, then Hamilton West, then district 12 ward 4, then surname index for the subdistrict ... and we find Carty ... and it says John and Minnie

click on that and you get the listing

Carty John M Head M Aug 1880 30 1901
Carty Minnie F Wife M Aug 1879 31

and at the top click 'split view' and you get this

http://www.automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=30180

it looks like Carey but it is definitely Minnie and is a driver for a wholesale grocers

he was born in England and emigrated in 1908


there is no result searching for Yvonne Carey ... the only way to get variations of the surname is to select all the possible soundex options since there is no 'fuzzy search'

there are 3 John Careys aged 32 in the 1911 census but I looked at them and they do not seem to fit


http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/cef/001042-100.01-e.php

this is where to search free for WWI attestations, most men would have had to enrol because of conscription if nothing else

the search results list shows birthdates

remember that this birth registration

Births Mar 1879
Carey John Edwin St. Giles 1b 629

could mean he was born in late 1878

no 2 on the list was born 29/12/1878 but he does not match (born Manchester mother Sarah)

http://data2.archives.ca/cef/ren1/004393a.gif


so no better luck ..........

Susan,

As you probably know Canada has several provinces and each appears to have its own records. Basically all Ancestry has in depth are records relating to Ontario. I have looked at Ontario Marriages up to 1928 but I cannot spot a John Carey marriage to an Yvonne.

Thanks Lynne
Is it a transcript you have of the 1911 census. Could the Mannie really be Yvonne??
does it have a profession for john edwin or "mannie"
thanks sue