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Sorry all,

Had to turn the computer off for a couple of hours as my plumber son was fitting a new motorised valve on the central heating and the electricity had to go off so he didn't kill himself !

Where are we up to?

Dea x

perhaps not too big a leap from cabinet maker to commercial traveller. It depends what he was travelling to sell - carpentry items?

There's also this Ann (not quite right age), but who are the other people?

Brown
Brown William 68 23 Shaw St 12-Nov 1901 B 160 C of E
Brown Ann 66 23 St Patrick's Row 14-Mar 1903 B 160 C of E
Howarth
Howarth Robert 82 yrs 23 Patrick's Row 31-Jul 1915 B 160 C of E
Lee
Lee Ellen 71 yrs 32 Broom Rd. 28-Jan 1941 B 160 C of E

From Wiganworld

Wigan Cemetery (Lower Ince)

Brown
Brown Ellen 19 yrs 20 Kay Street, Scholes 12-Mar 1879 E 140 * R C

Hmm not sure whether it is her or not now.

Right age for the death you found Gins but in May they were living in Horton street in Wigan.

Of course they could have moved shortly after Ellen's death or Ellen could have been living elsewhere.

The family were C of E (I think) but who is to say that is certain.

I found an Ann Brown in the same cemetery who was RC too:

Brown
Brown Ann 69 yrs Wigan Workhouse 22-Mar 1909 I 281 * R C

If this is my Ann, where was she in 1901?

Thanks Gins :) That may be him.

I cant see him in the 1911? Cant imagine he would change occupation from a cabinet maker to a commercial traveller, but I guess you never know

This is the only death in Wigan (If he stayed there) that matches


England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
Name: Thomas Brown
Birth Date: abt 1871
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1923
Age at Death: 52
Registration district: Wigan
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 8c
Page: 90

All merged successfully. (thanks Gins) I've found a Thomas Brown in 1911 from Gathurst as a commercial traveller , I'm wondering if that could be him? seems like a big change in jobs though?

Thank you Gins :))))

He was a cabinet maker :) I'll go and see if I can match that record up with my family tree maker tree :)

Heres Thomas

1901 England Census
about Thomas Brown
Name: Thomas Brown
Age: 29
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
Relation: Visitor
Gender: Male
Where born: Goathurst, Lancashire, England
[Gathurst, Lancashire, England]

Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 48
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 39
Piece: 3559
Folio: 9
Page Number: 9
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Mee 39
Mary E Mee 37
Frederick H Mee 14
Charles D Mee 12
Karl L Mee 10
Joseph F Mee 5
Thomas Brown 29 <Cabinet Maker

wrong mmn for Mary Hilda Gins

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1881
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
BROWN Mary Hilda Wigan Wigan & Leigh BRIDGE WIG/138/351

Mary May?

Baptisms: 5 Jun 1881 St Andrew, Wigan, Lancashire, England
Mary May Brown - Daughter of James Brown & Ann
Abode: 8 Horton St
Occupation: Boat builder
Baptised by: W.A.Wickham
Register: Baptisms 1871 - 1901, Page 29, Entry 230
Source: LDS Film 1885721

hello Ann, yes that's her....she may not have a birth certificate but at least she has a baptism thank goodness..

Her father is another mystery (well sort of). I've been trying to pin his death down before sending away for the certificate,

I thought he may have died after 1848/9 and before 1851 as the youngest child Ellis Aspinall was born about then (cannot track any birth/baprism records for him).

However, On Lancashire bmd (re) found this record this morning from 1845

ASPINALL William 38 Standish Wigan & Leigh STND/2/384

I'm beginning to think that perhaps Ellis belongs to another father!

i've contacted someone who has saved Ellis into her tree to see if she may have the parents names (i.e. father) - Ellis didn't seem to marry which makes things difficult :( I suspect that she may not be a descendant and therefore may not have tracked his birth down.

Thanks Gins :) However, I've managed to find most of the children up to 1911. It's only richard, Ellen, and Thomas that i lost track of in 1901.

And yes, i've been completely stupid....the death record you found earlier was for the daughter Ellen (not Ann) . Please don't laugh at me! :-D

Yes that could be her!!

Bear with me, Im trying to pin down all the little Browns to check if Ann is around

1901 England Census
Name: Walter Brown
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Relation: Boarder
Gender: Male
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Hinckley
Ecclesiastical parish: Hinckley St Mary
Town: Hinckley
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England

Registration district: Hinckley
Sub-registration district: Hinckley
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 94
Piece: 2961
Folio: 11
Page Number: 14
Household Members: Name Age
John Chamberlain 26
Emma Chamberlain 26
Walter Brown 22 <<<Gas fitter

just for info, do you have this

Baptisms: 23 Aug 1839 All Saints, Wigan, Lancashire, England
Ann Aspinall - 3d. Daur. of William Aspinall & Mary
Born: 15 Jul
Abode: Shevington
Occupation: Collier
Baptised by: Jas. K. Glazebrook Curate
Register: Baptisms 1838 - 1842, Page 76, Entry 601
Source: LDS Film 1885679

OK, no problem. So this looks like Mary Ann with her brother James

1901 England Census
about James Brown
Name: James Brown
Age: 32
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Millicent Brown
Gender: Male
Where born: Goshurst, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: Wigan All Saints
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address: 3 Scott St

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 37
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 48
Piece: 3557
Folio: 31
Page Number: 9
Household Members: Name Age
James Brown 32 <<<Joiner & Cabinate Maker
Millicent Brown 29
William Brown 7
Ellen Brown 5
Florence M Brown 3
Mary M Brown 19 <<Sister, drapers ass;

Thanks for checking Gins but I think her middle name is May. (she married someone with the surname Woods)

OMG.......Smith, Jones and Brown

Bless yer <3

Was the daughter Mary H and not Mary M?


Births Sep 1881
-------------------------------------------
Brown Mary Hilda Wigan 8c 50



Deaths Jun 1902
----------------------------------------------
Brown Mary Hilda 20 Wigan 8c 31

Thanks Dea and Gins. I really appreciate this ladies :)

Are Ann and Ellen interchangeable?

Gins - I know! lol I have got a Smith in the family (different branch) Note the singular- I haven't been able to go further back for obvious reasons lol

I think I have someone who married a Jones. Surprisingly I managed to find her death!

I have Woods who seem to be lost in a whole forest! With that branch, it seems to be their deaths that are the killer and the fact that they go off to sea every now and again.

Thanks for all your help so far <3

Brown........its as bad as Smith!


Ive looked for 'Ellen' using only her first name and year/place of birth on the censuses and tried to match her up with a marriage......zilch

So what about this for her death?


Deaths Mar 1879
----------------------------------------
Brown Ellen 19 Wigan 8c 43