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As you say, Linda it is one of the suprises of researching! But what a pleasant surprise to find that, after all these years, your mother was actually born on the same day as you.....that really is a coincidence!

Londonbelle thank you. I have looked at the military record and you are absolutely right. All the details regarding the marriage match up with the copy of the marriage certificate that I have. I know my mother never knew but that explains why she could not get a copy of her birth certificate.

It was somewhat hard to accept it when this at first it came up but I guess that's one of the surprises of researching. Coincidentally she was born on the same day as myself.

Thank you again.

Thanks Brummiejan, I've often found military records (that's if they exist) a great source for finding info of children.....this one certainly is the best find yet!

An incredible find Londonbelle - good bit of lateral thinking looking at the military records. Wish I'd thought of it. Amazing that they have given exactly the info needed.
Jan

Perhaps the Charles Fuller mentioned in the post at 17.13 is this one - living at 12 Frederick Street, Pancras on the night of the 1891 Census

FULLER, Mary Ann Head Widow F 47 1844 Boot Sewer
Holborn, London
FULLER, Charles Son Single M 19 1872 Collar Cutter
Holborn, London
FULLER, Agnes Mary Ann Daughter Single F 16 1875 Shirt Machinist
Battersea, London
FULLER, Lucy Ann C Daughter Single F 12 1879 Scholar
Smithfield, London

Piece: 125 Folio: 48 Page: 30 Registration District: Pancras Civil Parish: St Pancras Municipal Borough: Address: 12, Frederick Street, St Pancras County: London

Just found Military Records (1915) for Charles Frederick Smitten and there is an adopted child......just going to read it and will add!

EDIT

Wife Annie Lilian Richardson (Spinster) married 29/3/1891 witnesses Charles Fuller and Elizabeth Richardson.
Address: 135 Falcon Road, Clapham Rd, S.W. (this address is in 1915)

Adopted Child
Dorothy Barrett born 28th May 1912 Islington Infirmary

No other children listed

EDIT

Birth of Dorothy

Births Jun 1912
Barrett Dorothy Barrett Islington 1b 333

EDIT

Charles Frederick was awarded the Silver War Badge on 1 November 1916. Address sent to was 7 Ansdell St, Kensington Sq.

In reply to tempest's question yes I do have Annie's marriage certificate. The witnesses at Annie's wedding were Elizabeth Richardson (maybe her mother I don't know) and Charles Fuller. No idea who Charles Fuller was but he may have been a friend of the grooms, Charles. She shows her address as 12 Frederick Street but when I looked up the address in the 1891 census (this occurred just after her wedding) it was occupied by other families so I am left with more questions. The marriage took place at the Parish Church in the Parish of Islington, Middlesex on March 29, 1891.

In response to Gins the Smitten's came from Birmingham originally. There were several sons and daughters of James Smitten and one of the daughters married a Mickle.

Charles Frederick Smitten, one of the sons of James, was born in Islington, London.

I'm going to be away for a few days so will look into all your suggestios when I get back. Thanks again

1891 - think it's Thornhill Road


Name: Lilian Smithen
[Lilian Smitten]
Age: 22
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Charles Smithen
Gender: Female
Where born: Hereford, Herefordshire, England
Civil parish: Islington
Ecclesiastical parish: Trinity
Town: London City
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image
Registration district: Islington
Sub-registration district: Islington South West
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 152
Folio: 159
Page Number: 18
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles Smithen 22
Lilian Smithen 22
Elizabeth Hillier 72
View
Original
Record

View original image

Have you considered sending for wills of your grandparents, there might be clues in them?


You can send for them here at a cost of £6.00


http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate

There is this birth which is a bit odd. I cant see a 'female' named on the GRO record or a maiden name for the mother, maybe someone else can take a look

Im thinking it could be your moms birth, but its a big guess. I know we are looking for Annie but any bits of info that we can find might lead us to back to her


England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Name: Female
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1912
Registration district: Wandsworth
Inferred County: Greater London, London, Surrey
Volume: 1d
Page: 1&f5=1d">1409

UNKNOWN Female Unknown Wandsworth 1d 1409

OK so another Annie bites the dust!!!

Can anyone find mechanic Henry?

Jude

Poss 1868 Annie

1871 England Census
about Annie Richardson
Name: Annie Richardson
Age: 2 Years, 5 Months
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1868
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Wm Richardson
Mother's Name: Ann Richardson
Gender: Female
Where born: Biggleswade, Bedfordshire, England
Civil parish: Biggleswade
Ecclesiastical parish: Ely
Town: Biggleswade
County/Island: Bedfordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Biggleswade
Sub-registration district: Biggleswade
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Household schedule number: 112
Piece: 1551
Folio: 13
Page Number: 20
Household Members: Name Age
Wm Richardson 42
Ann Richardson 30
Annie Richardson 2 Years, 5 Months
Catherine Powell 70

Who are the witnesses on the marriage certificate? Do they give any clues?

have you considered this birth?

Births Dec 1868 (>99%)
RICHARDSON Annie Biggleswade 3b 359

Age at wedding would be correct and it's on the borders of Hertfordshire which might have been mixed up with Herefordshire? Though in both 1891 and 1901 it is clearly Hereford on the originals

I do find it very hard to think that she might have been adopted. She certainly would not have known but I suppose it's a possibility I might have to face. My brother was the informant on her death and we have always known her birthday as January 12. 1912.

I started this off with not being able to find my grandmother Annie Lilian Richardson prior to her marriage and you all have possibly just added another piece to the puzzle.

I must say I'm glad I joined this site as you are all very helpful even if the puzzle still remains to be solved, if that is possible.

No offence taken. I have been using ancestry and didn't realize so many people would try to help on this site. It's very nice that people take the time to do that. Thank you all.

Not sure you meant to mark 2nd posting above as 'answered' - this might stop people looking at your thread.
Unless you have a good reason not to do so, I think you need to consider the possibility as suggested by tempest that your mother was informally adopted - no formal adoptions till 1927. Especially as her parents were childless after 20 years of marriage. It was very common back then for children not to be told about their true parentage.
Jan

I am a member on here who is trying to help you find information, as are the others.

I am not connected to your family, I am sorry if I have offended you, but am merely trying to help you find information you have so far been unable to find.

So far we have all been unsuccessful in locating a record of your mother's birth, one of the next possibilities could have been as I suggested.

My mother was born in 1912. She was not adopted. She was probably born in Wimbledon which was where her parents were living in 1911 and she also lived in Plumstead.

Would you mind telling me what your connections are, .

Who was the informant on her death? i.e. where did the dob come from???

Jude