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I believe that the boy was, I knew that he died on the same day as he was born, with them being premature, I think that is the most likely what happened.

I haven't found any records on freebmd that point to him being named.

So was the boy stillborn do you think? I assume you haven't found any certificate for him.

A sad story indeed!

Yes, they were born and died in Queen Charlotte Hospital.
It must have heartbreaking to have had to name the little girl and register her a day after her death.
Both certs were dated 05 November 1931.

Just to one point on the question re twins being born around 1930, in hospital vs home

My aunt gave birth to twins in 1931 in Lancashire.

They were the last of her 6 children, and they were born at home, prematurely.


Both apparently fitted in to one drawer from the sideboard, padded with cotton wool.

Both survived, one died in 2001, the other is still alive.




Joe .....................

does Barbara's birth certificate say where she was born?







sylvia

Hi All,
I have received the birth and death certs of the girl.
Her name was Barbara Elizabeth and she was only alive for 3 days.
The Parents match etc.
It does mark her down as being the second twin and that they were premature, other than that nothing on the other twin.

Thank you again for everyone's advice, suggestions and expertise on this situation.
Joe

Just a thought - my mother has spent the last 50-60 years believing that she had twin brothers that died.

It was only after I started researching that I found 1 boy died at 4 days old and then 3 weeks later his 18 month old brother died.

My grandmother never spoke of them and somewhere down the line I think my mother and her siblings just assumed they were twins.

Could this have happened in this case????

I think I may just have to bite the bullet with this and order Barbara E's birth cert and see what it says.
Thank you again to everyone for their help and advice
Joe

I looked into Richard yesterday and discounted it so didn't post

This is the death

Deaths Sep 1931 (>99%)
Andrews Richard 0 Marylebone 1a 501

Birth

Births Sep 1931 (>99%)
Andrews Richard Murphy Marylebone 1a 705

Jude

Grandfather was born in Royal Free Hospital as was his younger sister.
The family was living in Poplar at that point I believe.
Not sure which if any church actively attended by the family, mother was raised lax Methodists and other side mixed Roman catholic and COE

Will see if I can find anything in burial records online for Poplar churches

Thank you everyone for your help
Joe

Do you know where your grandfather was born?
Could the twins be buried in a nearby churchyard or graveyard?
A check of registers locally might find a burial for them.

It is quite likely they are buried together.

Gwyn

I Have just checked the actual image on freebmd for dec quarter 1931 and Barbara E is listed but the only Richard listed is a Richard D mmn Green in Norwich

It always pays to check any image that has been transcribed

I think the only way to solve this now is to buy the birth cert for Barbara E to confirm parents and then take it from their

Roy

Received in a personal message this morning at 10.54 AM, as follows:

"There is a death for Barbara E & Richard both under Marylebone London 1931 on Findmypast. There isn't a death recorded for a Richard on BMD
so he could be the other twin?
desira"

EDIT BY ME: I think this birth has a different mother and is in an earlier quarter of 1931

Service is not available online. You have to apply for a form - which you need to complete - helpful if you know the actual DOD and location. Costs the same as a birth cert.

My mums cousin had a baby 60 yesrs ago - her hubby and brother-in-law told her family she had imagined it. We got a doc for her and she died happy. :-D :-D :-D

There's this

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=QxQjkIrKjkcC&pg=PA64&lpg=PA64&dq=maternity+and+child+welfare+act+1918&source=bl&o

and there is this

http://www.rcm.org.uk/midwives/features/the-midwives-act-1902-an-historical-landmark/

I remember an episode in call the midwife where a young girl had triplets, which she was unaware of...not sure if she had seen the midwife before hand though...that was in the late 50s

JannieAnnie, I meant as a registered professional with regulations which i think only happened after WW1? ish

Roy

Bit of an ancient profession http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midwifery

I do know that the mother came from a pretty well off family, although I understand she didn't have a lot to do with her family when she "married beneath herself". I know that her brother didn't take well to her marriage but am unsure of her parents, although I do know she was not included in his will.

I'm not a doctor but think midwifes could tell if it was twins? back then because their would more than the one heart beat? I think the only reasons i can think for a child to be born in hospital in those days was first if they where expecting complications and the other is simply they could afford it

Roy

Good point Jax, When did the use of midwifes become norm? and a profession

The mother may not have known she was having twins until they were born, If they were full term they would have probably been born at aprrox 8 months