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Peter, the Gordon family in Craigs do not have a son name James on the census & both parents where born in Derry. William was living with his parents and was 17 making his birth c1834, according to the census Glasgowlass posted, William was born c1824 (10 years out) and both he and his mother where born in Co. Down. I cannot find a marriage for a William Gordon to a Rose Kerr in Belfast.

Thank you GlagowLass and Maura, I have emailed the register office about the death in 1881 ... will keep you updated. And no, we didn't have the other Gordon families so it you have that information, then please send it on. Lovely to see and adds to the wider photograph.

The reason I feel FAIRLY confident that the family in Craigs, Ireland in 1851 are the same family who moved to Coatbridge, Scotland (my branch events moving to Middlesbrough in about 1867) is because, this family (children of John Gordon and Mary Burns) had the following children:

Mary Gordon, born c. 1840 (from marriage in 1857)
Sarah Gordon, born c. 1845 (from marriage in 1863)
James Gordon (my ancestor), born c. 1838 from 1861 census, c. 1840 from his 1865 marriage and when he died in 1876 (born c. 1836 ... however, there is a James Gordon, living with another family in 1851 in Craigs born c. 1834).

Also, William Gordon, in Middlesbrough was born c. 1824 (daughter's birth in 1824 and 1871) and then c. 1829 (1881) and then c. 1831 (1891) ... so he was fairly liberal in his 'ages' and I have not found a death for him. Also, his daughter's marriage in 1859 states his wife was being Rose CARR ... so maybe not KERR?

Does this help confirm these families one way or another?

Griffiths Valuation Record Information taken 1862

Tenant
Family Name 1 GORDON
Forename 1 JOHN
Landlord
Family Name 2 MARTIN
Forename 2 MATTHEW
Prefix REP
Location
County ANTRIM
Barony KILCONWAY
Union BALLYMENA
Parish CRAIGS
Townland CRAIGS
Place Name CRAIGS
Place Type TOWNLAND
Publication Details
Position on Page
Printing Date 1862
Act 15&16
Sheet Number 26,27,31,32
Map Reference

From the revision books, hes still at the same address until 1867, when a John Martin took over

http://applications.proni.gov.uk/DCAL_PRONI_Val12b/ImageResult.aspx

There still no marriage for William & Rose, but it all depends on which church they married in, as only St. Patrick's R.C. in Belfast has records for that date, the rest didn't start keeping records to later.

Ah ok, it seems from my ancestor's daughter's marriages that John died between 1857 and 1863 when he is recorded as a deceased labourer at the latter ceremony. However, James (my ancestor) and his mother are living together in 1861 and Mary, the mother is described as widow, theoretically meaning John Gordon died between 1857 and 1861 in Scotland.

So perhaps not the correct family?

Peter,
I understand that the children of John Gordon and Mary Burns were living in Scotland and some married in Lanarkshire.
However, is there any evidence that the parents were in Scotland at that time?
You say that Mary, the mother was living with your ancestor at 1861.
Where were they living in this census year? Scotland or Middlesborough?

Mary was at the Middlesborough home of her son William at 1871 died in Middlesborough in 1881.

According to Mary's death index, she was born circa 1812.
I would guess that her husband was born within a 10yr period of 1812.
Only 1 man called John Gordon born in this period died in Lanarkshire in the time frame that you give (1857-1861) but you would need to be certain that the Gordon parents lived in Lanarkshire when their children married ( or anywhere else in Scotland)
In what years did the children of John Gordon and Mary Burns marry, and what was the address(es) on their marriage certs?

Edit
I wouldn't get too hung up on spelling of Carr/Kerr .
Even recent ( living) Irish folk don't know what their name is... my mum 's maiden name was always Kerr ( birth and marrige cert) and her brother is a Carr. ( birth and marriage cert)
They have the same parents!
Previous generations also fliuctuated between both.

Thank you GlasgowLass.

Ok, Mary the mother was living with James in Buchanan Street, Old Monkland in 1861 - he was 23 she was 48, and a widow.

Ok, the marriages of the children of John and Mary Gordon in Lanarkshire are:

Mary Gordon, 1857, aged 17 living Steel Street, Coatbridge.

Sarah Gordon, 1863, aged 18 living Buchanan Street, Coatbridge.

James Gordon, 1865, aged 25, living in New Dundgran (that is guess work as the address is difficult to read).

In 1866, James had a daughter Margaret, born at 77 Buchanan Street, and 'Mary Gordon, Grandmother, Present', was the informant. This Margaret appears on the census in 1871 in Middlesbrough confirming the connection.

I should point out that in 1871, Mary is living with her son William in Middlesbrough and is aged 66, so born c. 1805.

Does this help? Thank you so much for this help!

Peter,
only 1 match to a person called John Gordon who died in Coatbridge in the time frame.
The death is registered in Coatbridge in1860
However ,( and I have never come across this before)...... there is no age for the deceased on the search field?
Enter age 0-120yrs and the match disappears?
As no age is found, it is not possible to say if this male death is an adult or child

I have also tried using various possible birth years within a 10 yr span and still no match.
The two possibilities are
a) no age is recorded on the actual Death Cert
or the more likely scenario could be...
b) the age of the deceased is on the DC but has not been added to the search field on Scotlands People.

Obtaining the DC is the only way to find out

Oh and... the address for James Gordon in 1865?... could it be:
NEW DUNDYVAN?

Hi GlasgowLass, thank you for this. Right, I have made a note and will look into the death certificate. And yes, the address in 1865 could be New Dundyvan. Thank you.

I am also interested in finding Ann Smith in 1861 census - if she was in Scotland at this point. Ann was the wife of James Gordon and her father was either James or Bernard Smith and his wife was Agnes Donaghan. Is there a likely family in the 1861 or a likely death for either of them - Agnes had died by 1865.

Very best wishes,

Peter

Hi again,

I have a copy of the 1881 death certificate:

Death certificate for Mary Gordon - Middlesbrough, Yorkshire
2 July 1881 - 4 Francis Street, Middlesbrough, USD
Mary Gordon
Female
69 years
Widow of John Gordon, labourer
Apoplexy 3 days - coma 2 days, certified by S. McHutcheon, MD
X The mark of Sarah Gordon, daughter in law of deceased, present at the death, East Street, Middlesbrough
Registered 4th July 1881


Although some details match, I am not convinced it is the correct one due to the informant.

What do you think?

Cheers,

Peter