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looking for a friend for the ancestors Sarah Elizabeth Barker b. Sheffield c1880
She married John George Ellis Sheffield 1903 they had a daughter Phylis Mary Ellis b 1919 sheffield, there may have been other sibling for Phylis but i can't find anything. She has no Cert's as yet to give any info.

I cannot find John and Sarah on the 1911 census, I have checked to see if the left the UK but can find nothing

Have you found Sarah in the 1911 census?....I can't seem to find her.

There are 2 Ellis/Barker births registered in Sheffield in 1916...

Births Sep 1916 (>99%)
Ellis John V Barker Sheffield 9c 1040
Ellis Raymond V F Barker Sheffield 9c 1296

You would need the certificates to find out if either one of them is the son of Sarah and John.

Hi

Have you tried looking here

freebmd

1881 England Census

Name:
Sarah E. Barker

Age:1

Estimated Birth Year:abt 1880

Relationship to Head:Daughter

Father:James Barker

Mother:Ann Barker

Gender:Female

Where born:Sheffield, Yorkshire, England


Civil Parish:Sheffield

County/Island:Yorkshire

Registration District:Sheffield

Sub-registration District:Sheffield Park

ED, institution, or vessel:10

Piece:4654
Folio:118
Page Number:35

Household Members:


Name

Age

James Barker 28
Ann Barker 23
James Barker 3
Sarah E. Barker 1
Infant Barker

Great Britain, Royal Aero Club Aviators’ Certificates, 1910-1950
about Raymond Victor Fernie Ellis Name: Raymond Victor Fernie Ellis
Birth Date: 2 Jul 1916
Birth Location: Sheffield

Officers Mess, R.A.F. Farnborough, Hants.
Rank, Regiment, Proffesion: R.A.F.
Certificate taken on: Qualified Service Pilot
Date: 28/05/1948

1891 Census
8 Records found



Piece: RG12/3826 Place: Sheffield -West Riding of Yorkshire Enumeration District: 10
Civil Parish: Sheffield Ecclesiastical Parish: St Lukes
Folio: 91 Page: 3 Schedule: 15
Address: 3 Ct 3, South Street

Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
LUMLEY Thomas R Head M M 22 Canal Labourer(Em'ee) Lincolnshire - Stamford
LUMLEY Annie Wife M F 31 Lancashire - Southport
LUMLEY Richard M Son S M 8m Yorkshire - Sheffield
BARKER James Stpson S M 13 Cutler's Labourer(Em'ee) Yorkshire - Sheffield
BARKER Sarah E Stpdau S F 11 Scholar Yorkshire - Sheffield
BARKER Thomas Stpson S M 8 Scholar Yorkshire - Sheffield
BARKER John W Stpson S M 4 Scholar Yorkshire - Sheffield
BARKER Annie S Stpdau S F 6 Scholar Yorkshire - Sheffield

Marriages Jun 1890 (>99%)
BARKER Annie Sheffield 9c 717 xxxx
Irwin Thomas Sheffield 9c 717
Lumlet Thomas Sheffield 9c 717
LUMLEY Thomas Sheffield 9c 717 xxxx
OGLEY Eliza Ann Sheffield 9c 717

England & Wales, Marriage Index, 1916-2005
about John V Ellis Name: John V Ellis
Spouse Name:Kathleen Dunkerley
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1939
Registration District: Sheffield
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume Number: 9c
Page Number: 1772

1901 England Census
about Annie Lumley Name: Annie Lumley
Age: 42
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1859
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Spouse: Thomas R Lumley
Birth Place: Southport
Civil Parish: Sheffield
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Thomas R Lumley 32
Annie Lumley 42
Gladys Lumley 3
Harry Lumley 1
Sarah E Barker 21 (Step Daughter)
Thomas Barker 18 (Stepson)
George Nicholson 29 (B in L)


Household transcription
1911 census
Person: LUMLEY, Annie
Address: 4 Low Street

LUMLEY, Thomas R Head Married21 years M 41 1870 Dock Foreman Lincs Stamford VIEW
LUMLEY, Annie Wife Married21 years F 53 1858 Lancs Southport VIEW
LUMLEY, Gladys Daughter F 13 1898 Yorks Sheffield VIEW
LUMLEY, Harry Son M 11 1900 Yorks Sheffield VIEW
LUMLEY, Ruby Daughter F 9 1902 Yorks Sheffield VIEW
RG number: RG14
Piece: 27897
Reference: RG14PN27897 RG78PN1596 RD510 SD3 ED5 SN69
Registration District: Sheffield
Sub District: Sheffield Park
Enumeration District: 5
Parish: Sheffield
Address: 4 Low Street
County: Yorkshire (West riding)
(7 children born, 3 living, 4 had died)

As George Nicholson is the Brother in Law, this is probably Annie's first marriage...

Marriages Sep 1876 (>99%)
Barker James Sheffield 9c 488
Nicholson Annie Sheffield 9c 488

thank you every one for your help, the second marriage solves a lot .

Need more help please to find John and Sarah on the 1911 census

Moira...what does your friend know about John George? I think a good starting point would be their 1903 marriage certificate. I find it strange that a couple married in 1903 did not have children until 1916+

Jude

I must admit that it seems odd to me for the child to be born so long after the marriage, she has no certs as yet, as I have said she is on a limited budget and I don't want to tell her to send for the cert and it be the wrong one. Thats why I am trying to find something on the 1911 census, to see if there were any other children before Philis :-S

Yes but finding John George on any census (before 1911) would be useful...and the only way to be sure it is him is to (a) find his age and (b) his father's name/occupation - both of which will be on the certificate. For starters, once you know his parents...you could find them in 1911.

Without this info it's like looking for a needle in a haystack. It is a very common name.

How does your friend get back to them? Is she related to Phyllis? Does she remember John George or Sarah Elizabeth? Does she know when they died?

Jude

If your friend does not have certs, how/where did she learn the names of Phyllis''s parents?

How does your friend know when and where Sarah was born?

Which cert do you think might be the 'wrong' one?

If there is no doubt about the info given, the certs of the birth and marriage must be correct

Or have you and your friend been guessing?

Are you absolutly sure you are pairing up the right couple for that 1903 marriage - ancestry is linking John George Ellis to Elizabeth Gertrude, not to Sarah Elizabeth?

If you know the parents are John George Ellis and Sarah Elizabeth, have you considered theirs may have been her second marriage?

Yes Flip...was heading that way myself (but can't find George Chadwick anywhere either :-(

Jude

Moira...we are going round in circles a little :-(

Can you post the facts that you know - and you/your friend know them.

So how is your friend related to Phyllis Mary?

Is Phyllis Mary still alive? If not, did she marry? Do you know here married name?

How do you know Phyllis Mary's parents?

Jude

There´s a death for a John George Ellis recorded in 1904 in Eccleshall Bierlow.
If it´s the same man, he could´nt be Phyllis´s father
Mother´s maiden name on the birth cert would be Barker, even if she had re married.

Yes Wisechild - saw that ......he was 51 years old. We really need Moira to come back and tell us how she knows what she says she knows about Phyllis - assuming Phyllis is the key

Jude