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Whilst researching Annie Thums in my family tree, I have come across this.

KIRBY, John Head Single M 30 1861 Watch Maker
St Meads, Hampshire
THUMS, Annie Sister Married F 28 1863
Hampshire VIEW
THUMS, Arthur Son Single M 5 1886
Beeston, Nottinghamshire
THUMS, Lily Daughter F 3 1888
Ilkeston, Derbyshire

How can they be brother and sister with separate surnames?
She had no sisters so I don't know how they can be brother and sister-in-law. However, her mother did marry a Peter Kirkby.

Is this the whole census result?

?????
Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Dec 1884 (>99%)
Bark Samuel Basford 7b 200
COOPER Mary Basford 7b 200
>>>>KIRBY Annie Basford 7b 200
>>>>Thums Arthur Basford 7b 200

Chris

Yes it's the whole census result.
So she married Arthur?

1891 England Census
about Annie Thums
Name: Annie Thums
Age: 28
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1863
Relation: Sister
Gender: Female
Where born: St Meads, Hampshire, England
Civil Parish: St Mary
Ecclesiastical parish: St Saviour
Town: Nottingham

County/Island:

Nottinghamshire
Country: England

Street Address:
Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:
View Image

Registration District:

Nottingham
Sub-registration District:

Nottingham South West

ED, institution, or vessel: 30
Neighbors:

View others on page

Piece: 2684
Folio: 88


Page Number: 41
Household Members:

Name

Age
John Kirby 30

Annie Thums 28
Arthur Kirby 5
Lily Kirby 3

Coz I found this

well I dont know !!!

I totally forgot about brothers being married, I assumed she was one of the children!

It came up with the children as Thums for me...

Looks like John and Annie ARE brother and sister as it would appear from the marriage that Kirby was her maiden name.

Chris

Well I,ve checked original and its quite poor but says as above

Thank you!
I'm slowly getting used to this. Also the census seems to make mistakes a lot?

The census are translated by people whom dont get paid now in this case the census reads

John Kirby ...head
Annie Thums .....sister
Arthur ditto.........son
Lily ditto.......daughter

Now is the ditto against Kirby or Thums!!????

That is the question!

This is what has got me stuck.
If the father is Arthur this means he was 15/16 at the time.

Who are you talking about? which father coz this man IF hes the father to arthur and lily they are 5 and 3

I dont think hes Annies father ..


when and where was annie born?

who are their parents

It's okay, I've sorted that problem out.

It's just the surnames now...

The two children don't appear on any census records with the surname Thums...

In your opening post you say whilst researching Annie Thums, how did you get to Annie.

Chris

Both of their births are registered as Thums though....

I searched Annie Thums in the census, which brought her name up
I then got her confused with another Annie, also in the family with a similar birth date

NO BUT Chissie posted THIS

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
......................................................................Marriages Dec 1884 (>99%)
Bark Samuel Basford 7b 200
COOPER Mary Basford 7b 200
......................................................>>>>KIRBY Annie Basford 7b 200
....................................................>>>>Thums Arthur Basford 7b 200


Now this COULD be this " sister" marrying her "brother"

Dont believe ALL you read
Only thing I was looking for is why 1884 for the marriage and 1891 still says sister but brick walls are never easy

I think it's quite clear that Arthur and Lily are the children of Ann Thums nee Kirby but have incorrectly been listed as son & daughter to the householder.

Possible Annie Thums nee Kirby remarried/cohabited and the children recorded under new name in later census..