Find Ancestors

the 1891 Census is the one above added by Chris Ho - Johannah becomes Hannah for some reason. Why they do this I do not know, but they cannot imagine that years ahead they cause their decendants a problem!!! :-D

Chris Ho,

The previous thread on the Kybert information you found for me is the relative coming forward who is now in touch with me and seeking the father of my William Turner (b1860/1). I had given up going further back - too confusing.

Maybe the birth cert will give us a lead - not sure though as it may be more confusing.

Will come back. Cert due to be sent to my relative approx 27th October.
:-S

Births Dec 1860 (>99%)
----------------------------------------------------------
TURNER William James Kensington 1a 4

(do you mean above for Birth Cert. ordered?)


Still not sure which address you was looking for...

Chris :)

edits

(1891 found by Shirley, from another query!, google brings it up when looking for Turner Clarendon Street)

Chris Ho,

Your last Census listing is correct with Jemima being incorrect as it should be Johanna (h) - my grandmother. This is definitely my family. William who died aged 13 must have been working from a young age, but that is the family without doubt. I have all the certificates for the relevant births, marriages and deaths.

The relative in London trying to go back one step further to get William's father William has prompted me to check via the address which is a chance search, but appears not the way to go. I wish they'd had the foresight to use different names for their children as it certainly is confusing.

Thanks so much for sharing your research thoughts and findings. We shall see what my London relative comes up with by way of William's (b1860/1) Biorth certificate. I could not confirm exactly which birth reference was for my William Turner so did not send - satisfied myself with the marriage certificate being correct mainly due to the names and the witness names - Jane Noble being Amy's sister confirmed.

Again many, many thanks, what great people you are.

Kind regards,
Sappho

Firstly thanks everyone for all the information.

ChrisHo has the right connection from previous research when I was seeking information on Amy Turner who we established married George Smith.

Sorry, but did try to avoid all the information I had already collected as I thought I would search addresses to establish just one part of the family - namely William Turner b 1860/1 - his father - William (James?) Turner.

It is so confusing and as I said it was not going to be easy with all those Turners.

I did not get involved in changing Turner to Tarner and was only aware of this through Dea's 'detective'work. I always think there is a danger in getting information changed without the correct proof by way of certificates.

Thank you again Dea, but the above may be realted, but not my direct line of Turners.

I am still seeking previous information for the family on 1891 census.

Back soon.

Sappho

Joonie - I think this is the family I was looking at in 1891 - William Snr. seems to have a new wife but as William Jnr has reappeared with the family (he was missing in 1881), then it looks like this family is not the correct one, even though the occupation for Wm Snr did match !!! .......dratt!! :-(


1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Conningham Road, Hammersmith, Fulham, London, England
Print transcription View image
Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William Turner Head Married Male 64 1827 Carpenter Southend
Transcription
Elizabeth Turner Wife Married Female 64 1827 - Southend
Transcription
William Turner Son Single Male 31 1860 Bricklayer Hammersmith, Middlesex, England
Transcription
Florence Turner Daughter Single Female 28 1863 - Bromley
Transcription
Abraham Turner Son Married Male 34 1857 Barman Hammersmith, Middlesex, England
Transcription
Minnie Turner Daughter In Law Married Female 25 1866 - Kent, England
Transcription
Florence Turner Daughter - Female 10 1881 Scholar Hammersmith, Middlesex, England
Transcription
Herbert Turner Son - Male 8 1883 Scholar Hammersmith, Middlesex, England


NB Their widowed daughter Julia Parker is living at the same adress with her son Albert (mentioned in 1881)

Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 40; Folio: 141; Page: 15; GSU Roll: 6095150.

Dea x

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 12 Oct 2012 22:29

Thomas on the 1891 census

1891 census transcription details for: 17, Clarendon Street, St George The Martyr Southwark, Southwark

Print Close
National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG12
Piece: 344
Folio: 137
Page: 5
Reg. District: St Saviour Southwark
Sub District: Kent Road
Parish: St George the Martyr Southwark
Enum. District: 6
Ecclesiastical District: St Stephens
City/Municipal Borough: Southwark
Address: 17, Clarendon Street, St George The Martyr Southwark, Southwark
County: London
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
TURNER, William Head Married M 30 1861 Labourer
London
TURNER, Amelia Wife Married F 28 1863
London
TURNER, Hannah Daughter F 10 1881 Scholar
St George Southwark
TURNER, Thomas Son M 6 1885 Scholar
St George Southwark
TURNER, Louise Daughter F 0 (8M) 1891
St George Southwark


1901 that you have already seen
1901 census transcription details for: 3, Hunter Buildings B Block, Little Hunter Street, St George The Martyr Southwark

Print Close
National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG13
Piece: 364
Folio: 33
Page: 19
Reg. District: St Saviour Southwark
Sub District: Kent Road
Parish: St George the Martyr Southwark
Enum. District: 8
Ecclesiastical District: St Stephens Southwark
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 3, Hunter Buildings B Block, Little Hunter Street, St George The Martyr Southwark
County: London
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
TURNER, William Head Married M 41 1860 Labourer Brick Seth
Borough
TURNER, Amy Wife Married F 40 1861
Borough
TURNER, Jemima Daughter Single F 20 1881 Paper Sorter
Borough
TURNER, Thomas Son Single M 16 1885 Labourer Brick Seth
Borough
TURNER, William Son Single M 8 1893
Borough
TURNER, Amy Daughter Single F 6 1895
Borough


both William and Thomas are labourers in a Brick Yard

**************************************************************

(ah!, was it above 1891, from below)

http://www.genesreunited.co.nz/boards/board/living_relatives/thread/1274755?d=asc&page=2

Chris :)

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1326659?d=asc

(reference)

(would it be Potman on 1903 Death Cert., notice same for occ. on 1901 Marriage TC Povey/Johannah)

(apologies, above Census I posted is 1901!) (now deleted)

Chris :)

I'm confused again :-)

the marriage record for that couple is in the name Turner, and someone has corrected the surname at Ancestry to Turner from Tarner (without giving the least explanation of course)

the image is really quite clearly Turner I think, and in 1881 that is what Ancestry transcribes it as (Hephzybah Turner 1827)

the image for the 1891 couple in St Geo the Martyr that Ancestry links to (William 30, Amelia 28) is also clearly Turner

Tarner does seem to be a name, but a rather unusual one, and at Ancestry it is definitely more often a mistranscription than a real name

(similar to Barner, most of Ancestry's Barner-s being misread Barnes-s, etc)

heavens, in 1901 Ancestry has the family as Turnex !

can you post some details of the 1891 census for this family? as I can't locate them in that year


This isn't to say they are your Turners, just not to rule them out, out of hand :-)

Hello Dea,

Just had another look at this one you added.

thank you for this and I was a bit excited, but the Tarner family are in the 1891 CEnsus and are a family with th name Tarner and not Turner despite the encouragement of your 1861 Census listing.

Good try though.

I am needing to do this by address I think. But JoonieCloonie is right - doubtful there will be answers via the address. I was just hoping that Wiliam and Amy may have had a relative like father. etc living with them, but guess not.

Still will wait for the certificate to seed if we can shed light on William's father.

Thanks again.
:-)

Thanks Dea,

Will get back on this. JUust off to bed now. Catch you all in the morning.

Thank you all so much.

Sappho

Hello Susan,

Just off to bed, but yes I do have the death cert. for William 15/12/1903, his occupation was Licensed Victuallers "footman"(?). No parents names on this only address 288 Tabard Street. and his wife was the informant Amy Turner. Tabard Street Newington.

Hope this helps.

Thanks

Could be this one??

1871 England Census about William Tarner
Name: William Tarner
[William Turner]
Age: 10
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1861
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William Turner
Mother's name: Hephzibah Tarner
Gender: Male
Where born: Croydon, Surrey, England
Civil Parish: Hammersmith
Ecclesiastical parish: St John
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Kensington
Sub-registration district: St Paul Hammersmith
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Household schedule number: 155
Piece: 63
Folio: 44
Page Number: 34
Household Members:
Name Age
William Turner 44 Carpenter
Hephzibah Tarner 44
George Tarner 21
Julia Tarner 17
Abraham Tarner 14
John Tarner 10
William Tarner 10
Matilda Tarner 9
Emma Tarner 4
Frederich Tarner 2
Risa Bushard 73


Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 63; Folio: 44; Page: 34; GSU roll: 824575.


Marriages Dec 1848 (>99%)
BUSH Caroline Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
BYFLEET John Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
Daines Mary Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
LAVER Elizabeth Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
PANNELL Hephzibah Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
Pannell Hepzibah Halstead 12 237
Smith John Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
Turner William Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view
Wilks Robert Halstead 12 237 Scan available - click to view


Have to rush out just now but will follow it properly when I get back,

Dea x

For Ref for us.lol

ondon, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921 about William Turner
Name: William Turner
Spouse: Amy Noble
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 5 May 1879
Parish: St John the Evangelist, Walworth
Borough: Southwark
Father Name: William Turner
Spouse Father: William Noble
Register Type: Parish Register
:-)

Edit

Do you have William bn 1860 Death cert ,I would think that may have his Parents names on it

If the one in 1860 is wrong, then this is the only other possibility. I think it could be that the year of birth is connected to the date the census occurs.

:-S

I think this may be something, but cannot be sure until we get the 1860 birth certificate and I cannot trace this without the input of my London relative. However, this is a possibility for William's father who is also William Turner:-


1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Household Information
Street ALFRED PLACE
County London, Surrey
Parish ST GEORGE SOUTHWARK
City
Town
Ecclesiastical District ST JUDE
Parliamentary Borough SOUTHWARK
Enumeration District
Registration District ST GEORGE SOUTHWARK
Country ENGLAND
Category Census, Land & Surveys
Record set 1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Collections from Great Britain
Person 1
First Name JOHN
Last Name NEWRY
Birth Year 1816
Age 45
Birth Town
Birth County
Birth Place Not Known
Relationship To Head of Household SERVANT
Gender Male
Occupation GLASS CUTTER
Condition MARRIED
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333
Person 2
First Name ANN
Last Name FARMER
Birth Year 1795
Age 66
Birth Town Birmingham
Birth County Warwickshire
Birth Place England
Relationship To Head of Household MOTHER
Gender Female
Occupation
Condition MARRIED
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333
Person 3
First Name SARAH
Last Name FULLER
Birth Year 1844
Age 17
Birth Town Birmingham
Birth County Warwickshire
Birth Place England
Relationship To Head of Household SERVANT
Gender Female
Occupation GENERAL SERVANT
Condition MARRIED
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333
Person 4
First Name WILLIAM
Last Name TURNER
Birth Year 1834
Age 27
Birth Town Southwark
Birth County Surrey
Birth Place England
Relationship To Head of Household HEAD
Gender Male
Occupation ...BUILDER
Condition MARRIED
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333
Person 5
First Name MARY E
Last Name TURNER
Birth Year 1828
Age 33
Birth Town Southwark
Birth County Surrey
Birth Place England
Relationship To Head of Household WIFE
Gender Female
Occupation EMPLOYING 1 MAN
Condition MARRIED
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333
Person 6
First Name WILLIAM
Last Name TURNER
Birth Year 1861
Age 0
Birth Town Southwark
Birth County Surrey
Birth Place England
Relationship To Head of Household SON
Gender Male
Occupation
Condition
Archive Reference RG09
Folio 3
Page 6
Piece Number 333

Sappho

By the way JoonieCloonie,

Lived in St. Austell for 5 years between 1968 and 1974.

Know the area well - hope you have had success tracing the families you connect with.
;-)

Hello again JoonieCloonie,

Had to rush to the farm - emergency. All well though.

I hope you are right, but my relative has sent for this so I cannot yet quote references. Will email him in London so maybe have it for tomorrow.

You have been so helpful. Thank you so appreciaed.

Will get back with some details once I hve them.

Regards,

Sappho :-)

just to note -- the William Turner I had in 1861 and 1871 with the Devon-born father is definitely wrong, your William was married by 1881 but that William was living with his parents still and was a tailor

fingers crossed that he isn't the one whose birth certificate you will be getting :-)

JoonieCloonie

Thanks so much - your information is getting there for what I hope to find via address.

Sorry it is confusing. I think I did overload on information, but trying to avoid helpers doubling up on what I already know.

So...what I hope to find is if William's family were at those addresses pre his marriage, which is what you are doing on your time 23.53 reply. Thanks I am looking at this now and find it interesting.

That William Turner Aged 40 with wife Emma 33 may well be of interest. No likewise, dates are wrong.

The Devon one we have discounted as I do not tthey moved very far in those days, but not to be totally discounted, but is interesting.

It may be of help when we get the certificate, but what if it is wrong? Let us cross that bridge later, but thanks so much for information so far.

Many thanks,

Sappho