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Incidentally, I don't know whether you had found this, but I noted that Frederica and her mother also seemed to use the name Thomson on earlier censuses.

I'm guessing that he either married overseas for some reason, or he did not marry the mother(s) of his children for some reason unknown ......

..... possibly he simply wanted an heir and a spare OR he just did not want to marry but his lover(s) became pregnant, and he took on the children (because of the heir theory).

Have you thought of getting his will to see how he distributed his estate? The Administrator Sidney Robert Ablett would have had to do as had been written.

If not, I suggest that you do get it, that MIGHT answer some questions, eg if he left something to Frederica and/or her mother ................. I find it interesting that they are living at the same address in 1911.


My theory of the heir and spare comes from the fact that we once had a neighbour here who had never married, but at over 55 realised owned a house and had some money but no heir ............ so he went to a foreign country, married a very young woman, brought her back, they had 1 child ............... and never co-habited again.

He made a small flat in his basement and lived down there while wife and daughter lived upstairs! He paid most living costs for them although the wife did get a job, sent the child to a private school and was thrilled when she won a scholarship to one of the top US universities.

Daughter got most of his estate when he died, wife sold the house and moved elsewhere in the city.

Thanks Sylvia. Great work

Sharon Ablett and i are in contact, and between us we have a lot of information ... It's just the marriage (as per census) of Joseph Pedley Ablett we are missing. :-)

did you see the 1911 census for Frederica Thomas??

1911 Census

Name: Frederica Thomas
Age in 1911: 40
Estimated birth year: abt 1871
Relation to Head: Daughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Battersea
Civil Parish: Battersea
Search Photos: Search for 'Battersea' in the UK City, Town and Village Photos collection
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street address: 39 Eckstein Road SW <<<<<<<<<<<
Marital Status: Single
Occupation: STILL ROOM MAID HOTEL
Registration district: Wandsworth
Registration District Number: 26
Sub-registration district: South West Battersea
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Piece: 2225

Elizabeth Thomas 85 b.ca 1826, Plumstead, Kent
Frederica Thomas 40

Elizabeth has put X and X in the 2 columns for number of children born and still living.

Not clear what that means

Frederica does not have any children

don't know if you have these records ...... from ancestry

London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965

Name: Joseph Pedley Ablett
Year: 1908
County or Borough: Wandsworth
Ward or Division/Constituency: Battersea
Street address: 39 Eckstein road

He seems to be sharing the house with an Edward Agnew. No-one else shown as resident at that address


England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966, 1973-1995

Name: Joseph Pedley Ablett
Death Date: 16 Feb 1908
Death Place: Surrey, England
Probate Date: 2 Mar 1908
Registry: London, England

from image:-
of 39 Eckstein Road, Clapham Junction, London, died 16 February 19098. Administration granted London 2 March 1908 to Sidney Robert Ablett, Commercial Clerk. Effects £30 0s 1d



Cambridge University Alumni, 1261-1900

Name: Joseph Pedley . Ablett
College: CHRIST'S
Entered: Michs. 1871
More Information: Adm. pens. at CHRIST'S, Oct. 13, 1871. S. of Henry. B. Nov. 4, 1846, at St Ives. Matric. Michs. 1871; B.A. 1875. Previously a schoolmaster for five years.

no image of this collection


There are 6 Public Family Trees with Joseph Pedley Ablett on ancestry

One owned by Sharon Ablett has this record for his father's marriage, notes that it is from Pallot's Marriage Index for England

Henry Ablett
Marriage
27 Jan 1835
St. Ives, Huntingdonshire
Spouse
Elizabeth Pedley


Another tree owned by debbietibando shows this transcription of the Pallot's record ...........

England, Pallot's Marriage Index, 1780-1837

Name Hy Ablett
Spouse Esth Pedley
Marriage Date 1835
Parish T S Ives Huntingdon

The image could be a shortened version of Elizabeth

Ancestry does have two transcriptions of this record, and the one for her is definitely Ezth ..........l

England, Pallot's Marriage Index, 1780-1837

Name: Elzth Pedley
Spouse: Hy Ablett
Marriage Date: 1835
Parish: St Ives



Re possibility that Frederica Thomas was possible mother of the two children ........ I note that she was 34 in 1901. That means she would only have been about 15/16 in 1882 when Thomas was born.

However, the name Frederick may indicate that she was the mother of the younger child.

THOMAS, SIDNEY JOSEPH ABLETT -
GRO Reference: 1882 D Quarter in THANET Volume 02A Page 914

THOMAS, FREDERICK HENRY ABLETT -
GRO Reference: 1889 S Quarter in GREENWICH Volume 01D Page 1035


no mmn shown, so certain that children were illegitimate, parents not married

ABLETT, SARAH ANN mmn PEDLEY
GRO Reference: 1844 J Quarter in ST IVES UNION Volume 14 Page 221

Joseph Pedley Ablett owes his middle name to his mother

from GRO .........

ABLETT, JOSEPH PEDLEY mmn PEDLEY
GRO Reference: 1846 D Quarter in ST IVES UNION Volume 14 Page 211

1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Providence Place, St Ives, St Ives Union, Huntingdonshire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Gender Age Birth year Birth place
Henry Ablet Male 30 1811 Huntingdonshire, England
Transcription
Elizabeth Ablet Female 30 1811 Huntingdonshire, England
Transcription
William Ablet Male 5 1836 Huntingdonshire, England
Transcription
Susan Ablet Female 3 1838 Huntingdonshire, England


henry is a shoemaker


on the 1861 census henry is crossed out

safc, you're my hero :) can't thank you enough :-)

Why can't I find things like this?? :-(

1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Kiddles Row, St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
- - - - Unknown - - Absent -
Transcription
Elizabeth - Wife Married Female 49 1812 Shoebinder Hilton, Huntingdonshire, England
Transcription
Sarah A - Daughter Unmarried Female 16 1845 Shoebinder St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Transcription
Joseph P - Son - Male 14 1847 Pupil Teacher St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England

????


Joseph P
England and Wales Census, 1861
Name Joseph P
County Huntingdonshire
Event Type Census
Event Date 1861
Event Place St Ives, Huntingdonshire, England
Registration District St Ives
Residence Note Kiddles Row
Gender Male
Age 14
Occupation Pupil Teacher
Relationship to Head of Household Son
Birth Year (Estimated) 1847
Birthplace St Ives, Huntingdonshire
Page Number 32
Registration Number RG09
Piece/Folio 979 / 85
Affiliate Record Type Household
Household

Role

Sex

Age

Birthplace
Elizabeth Wife F 49 Hilton, Huntingdonshire
Sarah A Daughter F 16 St Ives, Huntingdonshire
Joseph P Son M 14 St Ives, Huntingdonshire

Thanks Kath - I'll continue the search for a marriage (and keep everything crossed) x

There is this possible marriage:-

First name(s) JOSEPH
Last name ABLETT
Marriage quarter 2
Marriage year 1890
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ JOSEPH ABLETT married one of these people
Fanny Christmas, Elizabeth Darley
District North Witchford
District number -
County Cambridgeshire
Country England
Volume 3B
Page 1061
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005

Kath. x

People lied quite a lot. You can't believe everything you find on any record. However he could possibly have been married to someone else and so wasn't free to marry the mother of the children. People often said they were widowed when really they had just split up with their partner because divorce was extremely expensive and difficult to get for the ordinary person.

Kath. x

I agree. The mystery of Joseph Pedley Ablett lies in the Census data from 1881 (unmarried), 1891 (married) an 1901 (widowed).

Was it common to lie on a census? Or was this an actual marriage?

H x

The births would seem to suggest that the parents were NOT married. Sidney Joseph Ablett are forenames and the surname is Thomas. Illegitimate children were often given their father's surname as a middle name and no mother's maiden name appears on the GRO birth which also indicates an illegitimate birth.

Sidney born in Thanet, Kent and Frederick born Greenwich.

Kath. x

Not yet ordered the birth certs - found Sidney and Frederick on GRO yesterday.

Sidney Joseph Ablett Thomas b 1882
Frederick Henry Ablett Thomas b1889

Awaiting pay day ... it can't come soon enough!!

H x

Have you got the birth certificates for the two children? Did they have Thomas or Ablett as a surname?

Kath. x

Thanks Kath - I'll have a look into the marriage :)

All leads very much welcomed x