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My gran Mary Ann Gwilliam 1883 and James Ashton, 1880 I have now found on the 1911 censer living together ( Mum Gladys Gwilliam ) Knew the name of her Dad but it seems he was married , not sure if she ever met him as she lived with her Granma, can anyone give me any help finding the right family I would love to know what happened to him, did he go to war , I was surprised when it was on the 1911 census of them living together,

Problem is there's lots of the same name living in Lancashire to identify the right man

This is the only one I can see coming up in Heywood in the 1901 census:-

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
26, Byng Street, Heywood, Bury, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place

James Ashton Head Married Male 42 1859 General Labourer Heywood, Lancashire, England
Betsy Ashton Wife Married Female 44 1857 - Heap Bridge, Lancashire, England
James H Ashton Son Married Male 21 1880 General Labourer Heywood, Lancashire, England<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Samuel Ashton Son Single Male 18 1883 General Labourer Heywood, Lancashire, England
Bertha Ashton Daughter - Female 14 1887 Cotton Ring Spinner Heywood, Lancashire, England
Daniel Ashton Son - Male 11 1890 - Heywood, Lancashire, England

If this happens to be the right one then this is likely to be his marriage:-

First name(s) JAMES HERBERT
Last name ASHTON
Marriage quarter 1
Marriage year 1899
Registration month -
MarriageFinder™ JAMES HERBERT ASHTON married
Mary Alice Ramwell
District Bury
District number -
County Lancashire
Country England
Volume 8C
Page 670
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005

Kath. x

Hi I found 3 James Ashton's 1879 ,1880, 1881, all Heywood, I know the one you found sound ok, but just do not want to get it wrong, not sure where to go with it, thanks for the reply,

This looks like the same family in 1891 with James using his middle name of Herbert:-

1891 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Lane End, Hopwood, Bury, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place

James Ashton Head Married Male 34 1857 Labourer Bricklayers Lancashire, England
Betsy Ashton Wife Married Female 36 1855 Cotton Operative Lancashire, England
Herbert Ashton Son - Male 11 1880 Cotton Operative Lancashire, England<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Martha Ashton Daughter - Female 4 1887 - Lancashire, England
Daniel Ashton Son - Male 1 1890 - Lancashire, England

Kath. x

If James isn't named on your mum's birth certificate then you can't be certain that he WAS actually her dad so you are never going to know for sure unless you can find a baptism for her which names him.

Kath. x

Hi I found 3 James Ashton's 1879 ,1880, 1881, all Heywood, I know the one you found sound ok, but just do not want to get it wrong, not sure where to go with it, thanks for the reply,

Mum always knew his name and the family, and now on the 1911 census Gran and James are together, naughty gran tut tut,

baptism-
Name: James Herbert Ashton
Baptism Date: 24 Sep 1879
Baptism Place: Birch in Hopwood, St Mary, Lancashire, England
Parish as it Appears: Birch in Hopwood
Father: James Ashton
Mother: Betsy Ashton
Abode: Hopwood
-----------------------------------

His wife seems to be on her own in 1911:

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
670 Heywood Road Birch Near Heywood, Middleton, Lancashire, England

Mary Alice Ashton Wife Married Female Calico Weaver 35 1876 Lanc Pendleton

(no years listed for marriage- 1 child born living, one child died).
-------------------------------

Birth of child:
ASHTON, JOHN mmn: RAMWELL
GRO Reference: 1900 J Quarter in BURY Volume 08C Page 567
---------------------------

On his army record, James lists wife, Mary Alice (nee Ramwell) as his next of kin. Her address is Lodge View, Birch, Heywood. His address is listed as 22 Westham Street, Primrose, Lancs.

Can you post the 1911 census with James + your gran for reference please?

Dea x

Ahhh! - I have it (I was looking for her under the name Ashton..)


1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
20 Mount St Heywood, Heywood, Lancashire, England

Learn more
Print transcription View image
Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Occupation Age Birth year Birth place
James Ashton Head Married Male Carter 31 1880 Hopwood Lanchire
Transcription
Mary Ann Gwilliam Boarder Single Female Cardroom 27 1884 Heywood Lanc

|She was single - he had been married for 11 years (looks like), and had had 1 child which died.

It fits well with the marriage to Mary Alice and oher details given above.

Dea x

This could be the death of the child from his marriage (although no middle initial given):-

England & Wales deaths 1837-2007 Transcription
Print transcription View image
First name(s) JOHN
Last name ASHTON
Gender Male
Birth day -
Birth month -
Birth year 1900
Age 0
Death quarter 2
Death year 1900
District Bury
County Lancashire
Volume 8C
Page 341
Country England

Kath. x

Although she was married Mary Alice lists herself as single in 1901- living at the address given on James military record (Mary's mum's address):

1901 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
4, Lodge View, Heywood, Bury, Lancashire, England

Alice Ramwell Head Widow Female 47 1854 - Bury, Lancashire
Mary A Ramwell Daughter Single Female 25 1876 Calico Weaver Pendleton, Lancashire
John J Ramwell Son Single Male 19 1882 Apprentice To Printer Pendlebury, Lancashire
Jessie Ramwell Daughter Single Female 16 1885 Calico Weaver Pendlebury, Lancashire,

It's all adding up to looking like this is the correct family.

Perhaps losing a child broke up their marriage and since divorce was virtually impossible James just did what lots of people in that position did - just lived with someone else and got on with life.

Kath. x

Is this your mum in 1911 with her grandmother? :-

1911 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
8 Barlow St Hopwood Heywood, Heywood, Lancashire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Occupation Age Birth year Birth place

Elizabeth Ann Gwilliam Head Widow Female - 49 1862 Heywood Lanc
Elizabeth Gwilliam Daughter Single Female - 24 1887 Heywood Lanc
George Gwilliam Son Single Male Labourer Iron Foundry 19 1892 Heywood Lanc
Elinor Gwilliam Daughter Single Female Gater Ring Room 14 1897 Heywood Lanc
Gladys Gwilliam Grand Daugher Single Female School 7 1904 Heywood Lanc<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
John Gwillian Son Boarder Married Male Labourer Railway 26 1885 Heywood Lanc
Mary Agnes Gwillian Granddaughter Single Female - 1 1910 Heywood Lanc

Kath. x

Possible for Mary Alice in 1939 (divorced- see articles, James was possibly with new partner by 1933??- haven't time to check this out)-

1939: Riley Household 2 Schofield Street , Heywood M.B., Lancashire, England

John Riley 05 May 1896 Male Builders Labourer Heavy Worker Married
Francis Geraghty 24 Aug 1895 Male General Labourer Single
Sarah Harrison 21 Feb 1880 Female Pedlar Widowed
J Pickstone 30 Aug 1868 Male General Labourer Single
Herbert (J) Pickstone 18 Oct 1902 Male General Labourer Single
Bob Chapburn 13 Mar 1912 Male Demolisher Married
Mary A Ashton 12 Mar 1878 Female Cotton Weaver Divorced
Bridget Briggs 11 Mar 1858 Female Retired Widowed
Lily Riley ? May 1894 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married
-----------------------

possible death:

First name(s) MARY A
Last name ASHTON
Gender Female
Birth year 1876
Age 71
Death quarter 2
Death year 1947
District Heywood
County Lancashire
Volume 10C Page 342
----------------------------------

This article says he had four children- the article below says two sons:-


Clitheroe Advertiser and Times - Friday 08 September 1933

DEATH OF MR. J. H. ASHTON.

The death occurred at his home, 10, Thorn Street, in the early hours of Saturdav, of Mr. James Herbert Ashton. Mr. Ashton, who was 54 sears of age was born at Heywood, but had lived in Sabden for about 15 years where he had followed the occupation of general labourer. In March last year he was the victim of a serious accident whilst working on the Churn Clough Reservoir extensions, when he received severe head injuries. For a long period was Blackburn Infirmary, and on his retnurn had been unable to follow any occupation, and had gradually declined in health. He leaves widow and four children with whom much sympathy is felt. The interment took place on Wednesday.
--------------------------------

Clitheroe Advertiser and Times - Friday 08 September 1933

DEATH FOLLOWS ACCIDENT SABDEN QUARRY.

The East Lancashire Coroner (Mr. F. Rowland) fitting with jury at an inquest in Padihaui Police Station, Tuesday, found that an accident in March, last year, at a quarry adjoining Churn Clough reservoir, Sabden, had connection with the death last Saturday afternoon ot James Herbert Ashton (54), general labourer, of 10, Thorn-street, Sabden.

Hannah Ashton said that until March, last year, her husband enjoyed good health. He then had an accident while following his employment at a quarry adjoining Churn Clough reservoir, and was taken to the Blackburn Infirmary, where he remained for eight days. When he returned home he was attended by Dr. Lawrie. He had grown very feeble and died in her presence last Saturday afternoon.

Since the accident her husband had been in receipt of compensation under the Workmen’s Compensation Act. Thomas Alderson, of Whittaker’s Farm, Sabden, labourer, working for Messrs. Johnson, contractors, of Mirfield, Yorkshire, said that on March 10th, last year, when he was moving wagons out of the quarry on to the land line. Ashton remained in the quarry alone. On returning with the empty wagons, witness found Ashton lying on the ground unconscious. He was bleeding from a wound in the head, and was removed with all haste to Blackburn Infirmary. The Coroner: Did he ever tell you what happened? Alderson: He he was hit by a falling stone.

Dr Lawrie said he had attended Ashton on his return from the Blackburn Infirmary on March 18th, last year, until he was readmitted to the Infirmary on January 10th. He was then a patient for seven days, He had a depressed fracture of the vault of the skull, and surgeons were unable to operate. Death was due to cerebral compression a result of a depressed fracture of the vault of the skull. The Coroner: Was there any definite chain of cause and effect between the accident and death? —Yes, there was.

Without retiring the jury returned verdict Accidental death due to a falling stone. Mr. H. Backhouse, junior, who represented the quarry owners, condoled with Ashton’s familv in their sad bereavement, and the coroner and jury added their sympathies

Mr Ashton who had resided in Sabden for the last 16 years is survived by a wife and two sons.
----------------------------------------------

Wow you have all done well ,Mum and Gran lived in Sabden in Thorn St so not sure what was going on there but it looks like this is the right James, I have lots of Photos so maybe his new family are on them wish I had asked more about him now,THANKS ALL OF YOU FOR THE HELP, NOW CAN GET ON WITH OTHER THINGS, LOVE AUDREY

I AM SURE THEY WHERE AT WESTHAM ST TOO, SO MAYBE HE JOINED THEM THERE, MUM AND GRAN LIVED PADIHAM AND CLITHERO AND WHALLY TOO, SO I AM NOW LOOSING THE PLOT AGAIN JUST TRYING TO RIGHT IT ALL DOWN A BIT AT A TIME AND ON THE LAST BIT THANKS AGAIN AUDREY

Your Mum in 1939 ?:

Hughes Household 15 School Street , Heywood M.B., Lancashire, England

Mary A Hughes 06 Nov 1883 Female Incapacitated
Gladys Collinge (Gwilliam) 29 Feb 1904 Female Cotton Winder Single
Gwendoline Mitchell (White) 31 Oct 1921 Female Cop & Hewerer Single
-------------------------------------

James Ashton married Hannah Johnson (nee Hedley) in 1928-

She had 4 children- I suspect her two boys were James' children- born before their marriage:


Births Dec 1915
JOHNSON Margaret Hedley Wigan 8c 43

Births Mar 1918
Johnson Esther Hedley Wigan 8c 47

Births Mar 1924
Johnson James H Hedley Burnley 8e 320

Births Jun 1925
Johnson Arthur Hedley Burnley 8e 297
----------------------------

Hannah in 1939 (Hannah later married Richard Thompson):

Thompson (Ashton) Household 12 Pendle Street East , Burnley R.D., Lancashire,

Hannah Thompson (Ashton) 13 Apr 1895 Female Cotton Spinner Widowed
Esther Thompson (Johnson) 22 Jan 1918 Female Cotton Spinner Single
James H Johnson 10 Mar 1924 Male Iron Foundry Labourer Heavy Work Single
----------------------------------------

Gran Mary Ann Gwilliam married Joe Hughes 1925, , I spent last night trying to find more about the children of James mum never mentioned step brothers or sisters but she left photos at Thorn St so will dig them out and have a good look, I did find Hannah Johnson but wasn't sure, You have been great finding all this I have been stuck with it for ages , now I feel better about things , my DNA came out as most Irish but it did not add up to what I know, Mum Welsh and Dad from Lincolnshire and Nottingham, back to 1625 so hoping the Irish is on James side, thanks again audrey