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hi, i was wondering if anyone could act as a second pair of eyes for me? i have an ancestor name of nathanial lloyd, born circa 1842 in wales - documented as either denbigh or llanrheadr (?spelling) in denbighshire. parents ruth and unknown lloyd, step dad samuel hughes, half siblings mary and thomas.(all this info curtesy of the censuses) i have found him on the 1851 and 1861 censuses and also possibly on the 1871 and 1881 so i know he existed. what i am looking for is his birth . i have checked on ancestry`s bmds and cannot find him. i dont know whether its me not looking properly or whether the info i have on him is incorrect. any help would be greatly appreciated, sara

Could this be his Death? England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index: 1837-1983 Record about Nathaniel Lloyd Name: Nathaniel Lloyd Birth Date: abt 1842 Year of Registration: 1888 Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun Age at death: 46 District: Woolwich County: Greater London, Kent, London Volume: 1d Page: 623 (click to see others on page) I have looked from 1841 to 1843 unable to find Birth for Nathaniel Linda

I've looked from 1837 - 1845 inclusive and found nothing. Closest is Noah Lloyd, Ruthin. Are there any siblings that you know of? Janice

Nothing for his birth on N Wales BMD Reg

Possible father and grandparents on the 1841: Elinor Lloyd abt 1781 Denbighshire, Wales Llansannan Denbighshire John Lloyd abt 1786 Denbighshire, Wales Llansannan Denbighshire Mair Lloyd abt 1821 Denbighshire, Wales Llansannan Denbighshire Nathanael Lloyd abt 1826 Denbighshire, Wales Llansannan Denbighshire

Someone called Margaret has a Nathaniel Lloyd from Llansannan in her tree. Perhaps she can help you. (Found it in quick search) Janice

thanks to all who took the trouble to look. i wonder why we cant find his birth. i really wanted to find out what his mothers maiden name is, so i could try and go back another generation. he had 2 half siblings - mary - my g/g/grandma (1851- chester) and thomas(1849- liverpool), but they were from ruths second marriage to samuel hughes. i have tried to find their marriage also in vain due to not knowing ruths maiden name. i am getting very frustrated. that is probably his date of death as i couldnt find him after the 1881 census and according to the 1861 and 71 census he was living in the london area. they could be his family on the 1841 census, although his dad would have been very young ( a thought - ? may have been dads brother). i will follow it through on later censuses thanks for the name - i will try and get in contact with her

hi, just had a thought, in the 1841 census, adult ages were rounded up or down to the nearest 5 years, so the nathaniel lloyd actually could have been older than stated. therefore more likely he could have been the father? sara

It would be helpful if you would post the full details of one of the censuses on which you have found Nathaniel.......... You must bear in mind that registration wasn't compulsory until 1875 Reg

here is the 1851 census. family (ruth remarried by this time) now living in chester Mary Hughes abt 1851 Chester, Cheshire, England Daughter Chester St John the Baptist Cheshire View Record Ruth Hughes abt 1814 Ruthin, Denbighshire, Wales Wife Chester St John the Baptist Cheshire View Record Samuel Hughes abt 1803 Wellington, Shropshire, England Head Chester St John the Baptist Cheshire View Record Thomas Hughes abt 1849 Liverpool Son Chester St John the Baptist Cheshire View Record Nathaniel Lloyd abt 1843 Denbighshire, Wales Stepson Chester St John the Baptist Cheshire and for good measure the 1861 - now living in stoke. nathaniel has the name hughes but in later censuses he is back to lloyd again. Record Mary Hughes abt 1852 Cheshire, England Daughter Stoke Cheshire View Record Nathaniel Hughes abt 1842 North Wales, Llanrhaiadr Son Stoke Cheshire View Record Ruth Hughes abt 1815 North Wales, Ruthin Denbil Wife Stoke Cheshire View Record Samuel Hughes abt 1801 Wellington, Shropshire, England Head Stoke Cheshire View Record Thomas Hughes abt 1849 Liverpool, Lancashire, England Son Stoke Cheshire. cheers, sara

Hi Sara, For Ruth's 2nd marriage she would be Ruth Lloyd not whatever her maiden name was. However, her maiden name should be on the cert for the 2nd marriage if you can find it. Hope we can help you make progress on this one. The area is close to where I grew up so I can picture the places. Janice

janice, i thought your maiden name went on the marriage cert regardless? my sisters did when she married for the second time. i maybe wrong. i also know the area a little as when we were children we had a caravan on a farm a few miles outside ruthin and lived near rhyl. we had such freedom, so different today. thanks again for everyones help. i am doing this for my mum also. her and dad went to ruthin records office recently to try and get some info. but time flew by too quickly and therefore with little success. if i knew were samuel and ruth married ( i think either ruthin or liverpool at an outside chance) it would help. the only possible match for ruthin is samuel hughes oct - dec 1849, but there is just a ? were it says click to see others on page. sorry for rambling, just gets frustrating, cheers, sara

sorry i slightly misread your last post. do you think ruth would be indexed under her first married name as that might make my search easir, sara

I've checked the beta indexes for 1842 - 1850 without success. One quarter had Lloyd missing so if anyone could check the 2nd qtr of 1849 for Ruth Lloyd and Samuel Hughes that would be great. Likely candidate is Samuel Hughes, Llanfyllin XXVII 127 but I can't cross reference it. Janice

Hi Sara, I've looked at others in N Wales as well as Ruthin but there hasn't been a match. Ruth and Samuel aren't common names with those surnames so the search isn't hard. There were some Liverpool ones too and West Derby but again they didn't cross reference. Where outside Rhyl were you? I was in Kinmel Bay! Janice

ive checked the bmds on ancestry. com rather than ancestry uk regarding samuel hughes Llanfyllin and there are no ruths on the same page. i did find a ruth lloyd married 1848 oct - dec, but when i checked others on the page there was no samuel. i still think the samuel hughes oct - dec 1849 ruthin is a possibility but i cant x ref it. also their son thomas was born around 1849 but in liverpool, so whether the dates would add up im not sure. thanks for checking, looking through those beta indexes is slow going and eye straining isnt it? sara

hi janice, i lived on the west parade rhyl for a year when i was about 7 and then we moved to prestatyn, were we lived till i was 18. went to ysgol mair and blessed edward jones schools. a friend of mine still lives in kimnel bay. have you been back to the area recently? rhyl prom and shopping area have changed drastically since i was a child. i used to work in one of the arcades giving change for something like 50p/hour! sara

Hi Sara, Yes, get back regularly as my sister still lives in Kinmel Bay and Mum is on Sandy Cove. We went to Towyn primary school and then Ysgol Emrys ap Iwan in Abergele. Whereabouts in KB is your friend? Janice

hi, she lives virtually opposite asda, but right back off the main road - trem -y- something. used to visit regulary when mum and dad still lived in wales (buckley). but since they moved to cheshire 18 months ago havnt been so much. i also had ancestors from the llandudno/ conway area so am hoping to get up later in the year - money. time and children allowing, to do some sleuthing. maybe i could get hold of some chuch records. ive looked on family search, but as their records are incomplete, havnt discovered much about this part of the family there either. sara

i have just found a thomas lloyd married oct - dec 1842 in rhuthin. others on page include a ruth jones and a ruth williams. could be a possibility, but i guess, short of ordering certificate no way of knowing who married who. even then it could be guesswork. i just thought thomas cos she may have named her son thomas after dead hubby. mary (daughter) also i believe had a son called thomas who died young. if i order marys birth certificate would it have ruths(mum) maiden name on or her first married name. maybe this is the way to go, now i just have to find marys birth. sara