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This could be Caroline's death - date is a bit out according to the Army records:

Deaths Jun 1898 (>99%)

Matthews Caroline 30 Holborn 1b 435

If you do an occupation search on the 1881, for Ginger Beer Maker. a couple come up in Hulls Road (Benjamin Knowles & his son Benjamin) the street John's mother was living in when he joined the Army. There is also a Ginger Beer factory on the same street. Coincidence?

Hi Joanne

From the listing you will see that there are supposed to be 5 images. You can go into "view record", which in this case adds the service number and the age at enlistment, or into the first image, which gives little more than his agreement to serve for a short period - image number 15385 of 18660 images. If you click next, the following four images are more useful.

If you can find a pensioner ancestor, these are rich records!

All the best

Hi Ivy,

I've looked at the Clerkenwell one (if it's the right one I'm looking at), but it doesn't state anything about his wife or mother.

Am I missing something?

Joanne.

If you go into the "historical records" tab on the Ancestry.co.uk site, then under the search box is a list of "more collections" - click the "British Army WW1 pensions" link

It looks like he is the one born Clerkenwell 1879.

WOW, thank you so much Potty.

Yes, this is the right one. He did marry Alice Arnold.

I have Ancestry, how do I look at this record?

Many, many thanks.

Joanne.

Have just checked the marriage on FreeBMD. The WWI pensions record is the right one. If you do not have ancestry, PM me your email and I will send it to you.

According to it, his mother died in 1899.

Another possible?

John Robb Matthew Shoreditch June 1877 1c 100

Since Ancestry has the 1881 transcription with occupation, I tried looking for Fred* Mat* in London that year. There are several bakers born in Germany working in London, not all of them Matthews, so there may be a remote possibility that your John was born to a German father who later anglicised the name?

Was his Army number on his marriage cert and who did he marry?
There is a John Matthews in the Ancestry Army records with a mother Caroline. Wife's name Alice Arnold

Joanne,
ive looked and looked again, im struggling to put anything together, i cant find a frederick and caroline matthews together in a census.
i cant find any caroline spillers for births there are a few caroline spiller.
im wondering if she was a caroline, my gt gt grandmother had a habit of changing her first name through census, her name was ann but shes been anne hannah and even betsey on my gt grandfathers birth certificate.
Ive tried spillers/matthews marriages but nothing,
i will get back to you if i find anything.

Shirley,
I don't know if it's the right one or not. As I say, the father's name and occupation doesn't tie up but I wanted to find some sort of record for Caroline Spillers and Henry Matthews so that I can rule this out for sure. I can't find another John Robert Matthews listed in the births, so I don't know whether this is the right one or if he is registered under another name.

Claire,
Yes, this is the birth certificate which I ordered. I have been through BMD index on Ancestry year by year but can't find any other John Robert Matthews listed. I've also looked for Mathews.

I think I'm at the point where either the birth certificate is right, but then why can't I find him on any census's, or the birth certificate is wrong, in which case I would presume that he was registered under another name. If this is the case how on earth would I go about finding him?

Joanne.

I,m a bit lost . You say you got a birth cert but the fathers name & occupation didnt tie up. So are you thinking its not the right birth cert ?if so its not worth looking for a marriage for the parents quoted

Does anyone have any ideas please?

Joanne.

I am trying to trace my husband's great grandfather. His name was John Robert Matthews.

I have his marriage certificate which states he was 23 in November 1901, which would make him born c1878. I also have a photo of his grave which also corresponds with this date.

On his marriage certificate it shows that he was living at The Barracks, Chapeltown Road, Leeds and that he was a driver in the Royal Field Artilery.

I have looked on the 1901 census and found a John Matthews in Leeds who is a driver in the Royal Field Artilery and it gives his place of birth as Middlesex.

I have found a John Robert Matthews born in 1878 in Holborn in Middlesex, so I have got the birth certificate. However, the father's name on the birth certificate is given as Henry Matthews, a ginger beer maker, but on the marriage certificate it is shown as Frederick Matthews, a confectioner (deceased). On the birth certificate it gives his mother's name as Caroline Matthews formerly Spillers, and they were living at 4 Gastigny Place, St. Lukes in Holborn.

I can't find any trace of John on any census's before 1901 nor can I find a marriage or indeed any trace at all of a Caroline Spillers. I don't even know if this birth is for the same John Robert Matthews, but can't find any other John Robert Matthews which would fit.

Can anyone advise me on where to go from here?

Many thanks,
Joanne.