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I dunno, Amanda -- what notes??

Where did you get place of birth Chilton from?

Did you post that before reading what I have found?

I've found Sarah Chumley in the household with Mathew Edwards in 1881.

Who cares who said where that she was born in Chilton?

This is obviously not a clan that kept careful records and made accurate reports of anything.

In 1871, Louisa (sister of Sarah? cousin?) is shown as born in Middlesex. I can't find a birth record to match.

(If either of the girls was registered as Edwards, it would be virtually impossible to identify their births. But it seems to me that Louisa Sr. hooked up with Mr. Edwards well after they were born.)


But I think I might order this birth cert if I were you:


Name: Sarah Ann Chumley
Year of Registration: 1869
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
District: Bethnal Green
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1c
Page: 288


I don't see that person in the 1871 census or dying in infancy.

oh my god your a complete angel..... thanks so very very much xx so which surname do i go with cholmondley..chomandley or chomondely or new one?? ha ha x

thanks simon xx

yes i posted that before you found them... on one of the cencus for arthur wilde sarah son it had mother sarah born in chilton ... but hey never mind that xx

Seriously, I would get that Bethnal Green birth cert.

If it weren't for the fact that Louisa is reported, in 1871, to have been born in Middlesex, I would never have looked for it.

These were boat people. They presumably went all over the place. But Middlesex? Dunno.

I'd bet that this is sister Louisa's marriage:


Name: Louisa Cholmondeley
Year of Registration: 1885
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Wolverhampton
County: Shropshire, Staffordshire, West Midlands
Volume: 6b
Page: 884


It would be interesting to see what it says for her father's name.

She married either Alfred Evane (Evans?) or George Wilson.


Oh look!!!

In 1891:


Name: Louisa Evans
Age: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865
Relation: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: London, England

Name: Louisa Edwards
Age: 44
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1847
Relation: Lodger
Gender: Female
Where born: Wolverhampton, Staffordshire, England

Civil Parish: Wolverhampton
Ecclesiastical parish: St James
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Registration district: Wolverhampton
Sub-registration district: Wolverhampton Eastern
ED, institution, or vessel:

Louisa Edwards 44
Louisa Evans 26


That's your Sarah's sister and mother! (If such they were -- the people from the 1881 household with Mathew Edwards, anyhow.)


They are both widows, and they are both lock repairers.

The sad news is that Sarah's sister Louisa apparently did not have children.

Unless she remarried ...


This is probably Mathew Edwards's death:


Name: Matthew Edwards
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838
Year of Registration: 1890
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Age at Death: 52
District: Wolverhampton
County: Shropshire, Staffordshire, West Midlands
Volume: 6b
Page: 349

oh i just cant thank you enough xx

thanks agian... if ever you need anything let me know... not saying i will be of any use but i will def give it a go xx

Can you find your Sarah in 1891? I can't find anyone in the 1901 household:


Arthur H Wilde 2
Esther Wilde 17
James Wilde 35
James E Wilde 10
Louisa Agnes Wilde 4
Mary J Wilde 12
Sarah Wilde 32


for love nor money. Nowhere.

Did James have children before marrying Sarah -- or did Sarah have children before marrying James?

Oh lordy. The children's place of birth is "W'hampton, Staffs", and it has been transcribed as "Northampton, Staffordshire". Why those people couldn't have been equipped with atlases when they were hired ...

This is son James's birth:

Name: James Edmund Wilde
Year of Registration: 1890
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
District: Wolverhampton
County: Shropshire, Staffordshire, West Midlands
Volume: 6b
Page: 577


but no luck finding him or them. I just wanted to see what it might say for Sarah's place of birth.

Oh yes -- slobbering gratitude will be sufficient for now. ;)

I'm not sure that we've sorted Sarah out at all, but a few more certificates and maybe then. I'm really not a paid agent for the GRO!

no your an angel.... when you said they lived in grimstone st it sounded familiar so i had a look through what i got arthur wilde son of sarah and james married a lady called sarah price and her family lived at 23 grimstone st... its mad!!!! x

Hi Bumble bee and Kathryn
just had to say...
wow!! have been hooked watching you with this,and am amazed at your obvious expertise.
Thankyou its an encouragement to us still learning.
Well done,although I know you say you still have to get the certs to verify it all...it seems pretty good from here.
respect ! catherine

"when you said they lived in grimstone st"

-- I said that?? I'm smarter than I thought!

Ah yes -- the 1881 census gives street addresses, and I cleverly copied and pasted it. ;)

I'm not sure that the web will ever get untangled, but it certainly does seem to stick together.

Remember, now, that the Sarah Cholm...etc. who was an orphan living on the boat in 1871, aged 2, was there with an unmarried Elizabeth Price. I've always liked Elizabeth for being her real mother. ;)

Otherwise, I mean, what was up? They travelled from place to place by boat, picking up orphans??

It's just so odd that Louisa Jr. is with her mother in 1871, and Sarah isn't there.

I wonder whether Sarah was the daughter of one of the brothers of Louisa Sr. -- in 1871:

William Cholmondly 33 - son, unmarried, Boatman
Thomas Cholmondly 29 - son, unmarried, Boatman

-- and Elizabeth Price was the mother, and for some reason Sarah came back to roost with part of the Cholmondley family by 1881.

Just absolutely no way to trace that Elizabeth Price though; name far too common, place of birth in the 1871 census unintelligible ... and if Sarah was born Sarah Ann Price, ditto. You'd be buying certificates til the cows came home.


Oh, and Kathryn says Thank you, Catherine. ;)

Forelock tugging is always in style!

HI YA... thanks kathryn... what amazes me is that sarah's son arthur married a sarah price who grew up in the cottage homes wolverhampton, so she to was some kind of orphan... for some reason or another xx
ps catherine... kathryn is a genius xx

Just looking at the 1901 household (still wondering where they were in 1891), I see there are mistranscriptions.

This is the order in which they appear on the page, with my corrections:

James Wilde 35
Sarah Wilde 32
Mary J Wilde 12
Esther Wilde 17
-- it says 10, not 17, but 7 might be written over the 10
Louisa Agnes Wilde 4
Arthur H Wilde 2
James E Wilde 10
-- he's last, for some reason


Mary J was born in Newport, Shropshire -- but I doubt that it means Shropshire at all, it's just a ditto. All the rest in W'hampton, Staffs.

I really think they must have just evaded the 1891 census, being on a boat somewhere between here and there, maybe?

The various places of birth just puzzle me ...

hi sorry ...kids feed bath and bed.... i was wondering why i could not find anything thought i was doing some thing wrong..... arthur is my gt grandfather and i grew up with him... he was born in birmingham basin 1898 dec....
x