Genealogy Chat

NUDGE

Thanks to Snowdrop for nudging this thread for me. My grandfather was a serving sergent with the Green Howards in Richmond North Yorkshire 1940. His death certificate said that there was a PM and then an inquest after his death at the militiary Hospital. I have e-mailed my Archives department at York because the Coroner was from York. I took the chance and e-mailed York Archives on the off chance they may have something on the death. They have e-mailed back today asking for more info and my postal address. Earlier this year they found newspaper reports on my Great great grandfathers death in 1880. Look at the death certificates of your rellies. If there was an inquest ask!!! You will find that 9 times out of 10 the records are where the coroner came from. Vanessa

nudge

Thankyou for that explanation Vicky. In fact Dad did die in hospital. I too felt that there had been a lack of 'taking it seriously' by the medical profession until it was too late - I was not present at his death because of this, having been told six hours before he died that he was fine, and would be home tomorrow. Like you, I felt that everyone was very busy covering their backs. I dropped it eventually because I could see there was nowhere to go with it, no one was going to admit to anything. This followed a very similar scenario, same hospital, when my mother died with an undiagnosed heart attack, for gods sake. Dad tried to pursue this but again we got nowhere and eventually dropped it after the hospital blamed a junior doctor. Yes, I basically distrust the medical profession too - why cant they ever just come out and say they muffed it? We werent after money, we just wanted to know what had happened and why. OC

Just to clarify, if anyone else has been following this You can have a postmortem without an inquest. You can have an inquest without a postmortem.

Hi Marj, Sorry I didn’t get back to you last night. Usually, a death will be reported to the Coroner BEFORE the death certificate is issued if the death was sudden, or unexpected, violent or unnatural, occurred during an operation, was due to an industrial disease, or when no doctor has treated the deceased during his or her last illness. The Coroner decides whether a PM is necessary to establish the actual medical reasons for the death. Depending on the findings, an inquest may then be held. The coroner will usually only call an inquest when the death was NOT due to “natural causes” . However, I think this term is misleading. It generally means a defined medical condition or illness not brought about by artificial means, accident, violence or the intervention of a third party. It obviously does not explain illnesses of sudden and uncertain onset. In your father’s case, it would appear that the death was attributed to “Natural causes”. Presumably there was no suggestion of mistreatment or neglect by the hospital, and no public health or safety issues. I am sorry you may never know the true nature of the illness. I can understand the need for answers when a death is unexpected. In my case, my dad died in 2003, and at the time I felt that lack of attention by his GP had contributed to his death. After a long discussion with the Coroner (AFTER the death had been registered), we decided that a PM was not necessary as the actual cause of death was not in dispute (he died in hospital 12 hours after being admitted). I was advised to seek a statement of facts from the Primary Care Trust and then he would make a decision as to whether an inquest was necessary. In the event the matter was dropped, & I still have a basic distrust of doctors when it comes to covering their own backs.

Vicky Dad died in 2000. We asked his GP to explain the cause of death to us and he struggled - said it meant that he had been 'overcome' by a massive infection, causing all his organs to fail. My cousin is a nurse and took a copy of the Death Cert, to ask a Consultant the same question. He also said it was a massive infection. I phoned the hospital as I wanted to know what the 'infection' was (this was long after the funeral though) and they were very kind and helpful, but it was still 'massive infection' of unknown origin. I spoke to my Dad on the phone 2 days before he died - he was his usual bouncy self and had been cutting back trees all day. He did not mention feeling ill (and he was a terrible hypochondriac, so definitely would have). Even his GP remarked to me that he had seen Dad on the same day I phoned him, doing his daily five mile walk. I dont suppose I will ever find out now but it still bothers me - what kind of infection strikes so quickly? And why can no one give it a name? OC

OC, its my understanding that the Coroner decides whether an inquest is necessary. (The Coroner can also request a PM, if not already done.) Again, only my ''take'' on things, but if the cause of death (as shown by the PM) doesn't reveal any unusual circumstances, there wouldn't be the need for an inquest. Although it sounds that the family were concerned about the circumstances: these days, this would result in at least a chat with the coroner's office about why he didn't feel an inquest was necessary. How long ago? Perhaps procedures have changed a bit since then.

Hello Olie. Sorry do not know what else to call you. My grandfather`s death certificate stated that there had been a PM. And the dates on which it was held. Not knowing the reason for your rellies death i could not comment. Maybe when Ian returns he may be able to throw some light on it I hope so for your sake. Vanessa.

Puzzled - a post mortem was performed on my father but no inquest was held! We queried the cause of death (it was completely incomprehensible, in medical terms) and kicked up quite a fuss - but we never got to see the Post Mortem report. Are you saying that it is in fact possible? I would still like to know why my father was bouncing around on the Monday, yet dead from what was explained to us as 'a massive infection' the following day. OC

Thank you Vicky. At least i know that he is not ignoring me. According to GR i have recieved or sent a message to Ian but i can not find it! Never mind. I will be patient and wait. Vanessa

AAHHHH!!!!! BIG BROTHER ADDICTION NOT EVICTION!!! No, i have not clicked on his name but will do now. Let you know the outcome. Vanessa

Vanessa Have to admit I haen't seen him around for ages. He did post on the General board a while ago that he wasn't going to bother with the site (board?) anymore because of all the 'trouble'. Have you tried clicking on his name to see if it's still 'live' Back to second half of BB in a minute - Sam was evicted, there's a surprise!!! New one about to go in though, more fun and games? Snowdrops

Snowdrop. Do you know if Ian is still on this website? Vanessa

My father died at 59 with pneumon...osis.. (brick dust in the lungs) and there was a PM and inquest Kim Jean

Thank you Snowdrop for nudging this up for me. The tread is very intresting! I wonder if the same rules apply for a death in the army? My grandfather died while in hospital in 1940. The hospital was:- Military Hospital, Scotton RD. Vanessa

I didn't realise this thread would be so useful! It does help clarify the difference between post mortems and inquests - not the same thing, but easily mixed up. I found this site the other day which might also help http://www.surreycoroner.info/workofcoroners.html#who

Nudge for Vanessa Snowdrops

Hi all, It never ceases to amaze me the wealth of information we have between us - guess what this board is all about eh? Thank you all for taking the time to respond - I will certainly be exploring each and avenue. Kim

i have had a few of these and all though the inquest reports do not exsist, there was always a detailed report of the inquest in the local paper, explaining the details of the event