General Chat

If the Bible is to be believed, then Hell does not exist,as a place of torment...it is just a name given to the common grave....
as it says
The dead, are dead and conscience of nothing, and that they await a resurection.

Rolling Eyes .I do it all the time .I remember my mum saying don't roll your eyes at me!!!!!!

There are several interpretations.
This site puts forward one viewpoint
http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=400

Here is one lot trying to convince us that it does exist and is even in the centre of the Earth
http://www.av1611.org/hell.html

This is the opinion of a different group having read exactly the same texts. For briefer explanation read last paragraph
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/TheBibleHell.html

What these and other sites I have looked at show us is that translating any document means either a loss or confusion of meaning. In English we have the Anglo-Saxon word Hell but that word has been used as a translation for several different words with rather different meanings in the Bible.

Different groups studying the same texts come to very different conclusions and this rather leaves each of us to make up our own minds.

Sue

Well I was thinking more after we die - than while we are still here to choose our path :)

edit: referring to the statement ... what will be will be

Sue...It brings to mind what my English tutor said about interpreting the writers' work..... there are many ways of interpreting a text, some will be very far from what the author meant.... at some point in time it is just possible that people may , with the shift in meaning of words and changes in society, read 'Hamlet' as a comedy...

even now the word' wicked' for example has two diametrically opposed meanings !

and that is leaving out the difficulties of translation which is at best very inexact, as it has been done so many times already....

xx

This is a very interesting site with full explanations of the meanings of the original words.
I also agree with much in the last few paragraphs. I have come across a few who could benefit from reading those.

http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/hell.html


Sue

Hi Rose

I'm almost tempted to believe in mind reading (but not quite!)

I was just thinking about the differences that are possible in translation and I was thinking about how two translations of the same original text could be translated as

"the lady stayed at home" and "the lady waited at home"

Mills and Boons could make a whole different story based on either ending, yet the original text would have been the same.

He came to find her - the lady had her own plans - she stayed at home

Or

He came to find her - the lady had been expecting him for years - she waited at home

Does this make sense?

Hell, as they say, has no fury etc etc

Sue

Death is very personal which cannot be shared. Everyone must make his own way to his God.

Most of us start our last journey in the back of a hearse.

well our bodies do dermot.. i like to think that the spirit has gone on before.....

"This above all: to thine own self be true"


William Shakespeare (1564 - 1616), 'Hamlet,' Act I, Scene iii


can mean

"do your own thing and don't worry about other people or the consequences."

or it can mean ' value yourself and stay true to your beliefs and opinions '

and probably a lot more besides! lol

xx

rose, i think it's the same with works of art..different critics see different things in them, i am sure a lot of the famous paintings have things read into them that were never intended by the artist.

Funerals are for those left living, not the dead.

For me anyway, they are closure. Acceptance for the passing of someone I've loved and cared for and some kind of 'permission' to get on with living again... They are for those at the funeral to celebrate and remember the life of their loved one. They are to be thankful for knowing the person and for remembering how your life has been enriched by their life. It's to feel sad at never seeing them again, but remembering that they will always be alive in your memories.

Well, that's what I think. Everyone is different I guess. Maybe I'm just a sentimental fool!

I am sure Stella... and equally that some have missed something that the artist saw... I read it described as 'seeing the patient angel' ie the portrait artist seeing in the sitter something beyond the physical characteristics, the soul behind as it were.

xx

lol no Dermot, I wouldn't say you were a 'sentimental fool' at all :)

you have understood my meaning rose.... exactly

different people... different generations ... transcribe things in many different ways

sorry dermot... i agree with you about funerals yes..i was just realy thinking about the spirit leaving, wheni worked in care and one of our residents died i was taught to open a window to help the spirit leave.. sounds odd maybe but that was what we did ..

Goodnight all, and thanks for an interesting discussion :)
sleep well

Rose xx

good night god bless

xxxx

This has been a really interesting thread - well done!

*************************

I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell for the company
I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell seems like fun to me

There’s something in the sun this day, I feel it
Or maybe it’s just my hayfever
The weeds are green, the sky is shining
But it’ll soon be night which is nicer
But then cracks peel back and Hell bends the room
And the Devil gestures to you
You’ve never seen such a Beelzebu
And he’s telling you to make up your bean about what’s left of your evening
About whether to flake out or stay out
What do you make of this doubt?
The devil wants to know if you’re going down or up
Easy - I know what my speech should be

I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell for the company
I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell seems like fun to me

The Devil beams a big beaming grin
The sort which leads you up the streets of sin
He holds up paperwork - sign the line
Let’s clash with madmen, grime is fine
It sounds all hectic, you’re having cold feet
Things are getting out of hand, you make an embarrassing retreat

Let’s ride the Valkyrie, commit a bit of sin
Turn rock to rubble, punch me in the chin
I simply, Lucifer, refuse to wind up on fire with low-life liars
Then you’re destined for the world without chores and sweating -
The eternal Hell of boredom in Heaven

I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell for the company
I want to go to heaven for the weather
But Hell seems like fun to me

You tell the devil in no uncertain terms
You’ll never be evil, you’ll never be turned
What is this evil? And who decides this?
When left to devices some humans try s***
This is the reason we should all be tied up?
We’re just normal people exploring our minds
We don’t go around here putting poison in wine
But we enjoy what we like which is not always right
People are intricate, people aren’t swines
Let’s screw the rules up and rely on our minds
Sign on the line
You sign on the line
He clutches the wine and tips it in cyanide

I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell for the company
I want to go to Heaven for the weather
But Hell seems like fun to me

Lyrics courtesy of Mike Skinner/The Streets

If its of interest to anyone, I believe when we die, we cease to exist from that point on. I would like to believe the bhuddist view that we move on to another life.

I believe we are accountable somehow for our actions, and have seen several times 'what goes around, comes around'

As for hell.......we can create that for ourselves and I believe some people when they say their life is sheer hell albeit sometimes not of their own making

The big problem with most religions is that they firmly, sometimes fanatically believe only theirs is the right one.
Religions which condone murdering non believers I see as dangerous.

Chris