General Chat

A supposedly competent firearms officer discharges a live round into the ground, in front of a class of school children???
and the empty case hits a child in the face.............

Bl*&dy hell if I did that I'd be locked up forever................

Bob

he wasn't on firearm duties at the time..................so what was he doing with a loaded weapon in a school situation?

and bearing in mind the police are permitted to used undesirable bullets......???
say no more........


OH! I Forgot.............they've apologised...........i

Paddy Tipping, Nottinghamshire Police and Crime Commissioner, said the girl was injured by the empty cartridge when it ejected from a gun fired into the ground on Thursday last week.

She suffered a "minor injury to her lip", police said.

The group of children and parents were being shown specialist police services including firearms and dogs at Sherwood Lodge, near Hucknall, after they won a local prize, he said.


"I am shocked, concerned and alarmed," he added. "This is a very serious incident and I have discussed it at length with the Chief Constable. I have received assurances it will never happen again."

The officer involved was a fully-trained firearms officer, Mr Tipping said, but was not currently on firearms duties, pending the outcome of the investigation.

No further details on the firearm have been revealed. The girl's parents, who were with her at the time, have been in regular contact with the Chief Constable.

Assistant Chief Constable Simon Torr said: "We are conducting a thorough inquiry to determine exactly how this unfortunate incident happened and have also referred the matter to the Independent Police Complaints Commission.

"We have spoken to the parents who were visiting force headquarters with their children to explain what happened and have apologised for any distress caused."

A Police Federation representative confirmed they were supporting the officer involved but could not comment any further at this stage.


That OK, Then, They've apologised!!

and in another instance............

Children as young as four have been mistakenly sprayed with "hot chilli" by Gwent Police.

On Wednesday, officers visited Ysgol Gymraeg Gilfach Fargoed, in Bargoed, Caerphilly county, and gave a lesson on equipment used by the force.

But instead of demonstrating a mock PAVA spray, which replaced CS spray, officers discharged a real canister.

The spray, used on eight pupils aged four and five, causes the eyes to close and is extremely painful.

None of them needed hospital treatment, said the force, which has apologised for the error.

"Parents were contacted by a senior officer to explain what happened, discuss any concerns and offer our sincere apologies," a spokesman said.

"Medical treatment wasn't required on the day, however, parents were advised to seek medical attention if they had any concerns.

"Further enquiries into the error are now being undertaken and, as a result of yesterday's incident, school liaison officers will no longer be taking any demonstration (mock) PAVA spray into schools."

PAVA (pelargonic acid vanillylamide) replaced CS spray because it was said to be safer and more effective when restraining suspects.

It is claimed it is less likely to contaminate officers or bystanders.


Oh!!!! Once again, They've apologised.......

He should pay a visit to the Meadows, Nottingham and he's soon find out how guns are used.

A loaded firearm ( other than in practice range ) at police hq is barely credible. In the same space as civilians and kids on top words fail me. He is very lucky the injury was not more serious.

Such an event suggests a complete lack of proper firearms management and training in the Notts force ( which has overall a poor performance record anyway. ) Firearms permission should be withdrawn from the whole force until the matter is sorted.

Meanwhile they could rely on er um ... Leicestershire, Derbyshire, well probably best not so that leaves the Met well known for their shooting prowess if less proficient at target selection. The Lincs force could not find their way to Nottingham even with a map whatever you may see on TV.

Toytown police, grown up toys not a good mixture.

:-0

Small man syndrome and showing off comes to mind.
Surely they shouldn't have loaded firearms / anti-riot gear on them, unless called to an incident - or on special patrol?
Certainly not at a school.

One law for some..............

Always the way!

In my experience the average policeperson isn't awfully bright. I wouldn't trust most of them with a peashooter.

there was a period when our local range was going to be used by these type of experts,

I said to someone in the know,
when they are here, would it be exclusive use? or can we observe them in action......?

..
the reply was not as you would think "no its secret"............ but on the lines of " I wouldn't want to be within a mile of 'em!!"

No doubt the "Lessons will be Learnt" will be canted out again as per. The mind Boggles at it Incompetance of these people.

Oh don't worry they are all trained to the highest standard and all sorts of safety checks are in place! Just like the coppers using their personal radio in the fly on the wall programmes while in pursuit, too dangerous for a motorist to use it while stuck in traffic, but OK for the officer clocking 70 through a built up area ;-)

Do as I say not as I do :-P

Ahem! A few posters need to take a lesson on how to make a point without being disrespectful to the whole police force.

Trouble is Dermot its the careless ones that get the attention when things go wrong.....but live firearms ,"cs" type spray alternatives,and children don't mix........allegedly, they let the children handle these "toys"

remember the poor kid in the states, the instructor, and the uzzi

I respect the police who behave appropriately and disrespect those who don't. Of which there are far too many.

And I don't need lessons on what I can post.

Guinevere - I just felt that your earlier posting was a bit hurtful, harsh & demeaning - giving the impression that none were very 'bright'.

That being so, it was an unfair slur on a generally competent force - as far as I have knowledge of its staff & officers’ capability.

I said in my experience "the average policeperson" isn't very bright, Dermot, it's the truth. I've met quite a few in the course of my work and, in general, that's what I've found.

And recent newspaper reports seem to bear that out.

And it still isn't your place to tell me what and how to post.

I was going to post that I wasn't totally offended by Guinevere's post as the words 'average' and 'most' were used.

I'm a retired officer who is actually quite bright and can be trusted totally. I think it's an absolute disgrace that these incidents have occurred and there should be serious repercussions for those involved. It was just the same when a dog handler left his dog in his police vehicle at headquarters on a very hot day and the dog died as a result. I have no doubt that the punishment given was far less than had it been an ordinary member of the public.

I just think it's such a shame that the majority of officers get tarred with the same brush when this sort of thing happens as there are so many excellent hard working officers out there.

Chris

That's exactly it, Chrissie. I have met a handful, like yourself, who I would trust absolutely, including a good friend. He wasn't much impressed with a lot of those serving under him, hence his early retirement.

Policing has changed since the 50s and 60s but a lot of the old lazy habits remain for some. Police officers today need a higher standard of education because of the challenges they face with new legislation. When I was teaching many that I met didn't understand the law they were supposed to be upholding. I wish that wasn't the case but it was.

And a very few are dishonest. They used to be able to get away with it but in these days of CCTV and recorded interviews they can't.

I agree with you Guinevere, policing has changed so much. I initially joined in 1977 when it was a disciplined service, sadly a lot of that has gone too. Initial training has also changed, no having to learn the definitions of offences parrot fashion and fully understanding the meaning of the offence these days.

Yes there are a few that are dishonest, but I can honestly say that the investigation is even more thorough when carried out by the Complaints and Discipline dept when serving officers are involved. No one hates a bent copper more than decent officers. I've been retired 6 years and I've been quite shocked at just how many officers from my own division have been sacked since I left, good riddance too.

Far too many also have the wrong attitude, they put their uniform on and the power goes to their head.

Chris

What ever possesses anyone to expose young children to firearms in the first place,,,,,,,, Mad........!