Find Ancestors

Catherine i had already edited my post, she declared 3 years married and 2 live births.

With her being a domestic in another household, i do wonder if the children were given up as they couldn't cope?

I'm still trying to find Thomas with the 2 children, i may find him with his family...

Sharon what is Thomas occupation on the birth cert?

I have found a Thomas Johnson married living with parents....He's a Carman born brentford. Sadly he's not required to fill in the marriage section.


Tracey x

I have foudn this one.

JHONSON, Thomas Samuel Nurse Child M 0 (10 MONTHS) 1911 Brentford Middx

Living with the Lovegrove family.


Tracey x

Yes, Tracy I've just seen that.

I'm also beginning to think that the children may just have been adopted, but I'm not sure how to find adoptions!

Possible 1911 but wrong middles name:-
HOUSEHOLD JHONSON THOMAS SAMUEL M 1910 10 MONTHS Brentford Middlesex

Snap!

Thomas father on birth certificate shows him a a general carman, his parents are Samuel Johnson - 1862, Brentford, Middlesex & mother Catherine (Kate) Donovan - 1861 - Shadwell, London

Hi Sharon
I would like to ask again the question that Wayne/tracey asked which was how do you know that you have the right cert. I noticed that your mother in law was born in the same district of Brighton in 1938 as the Thomas Bertram Kershaw born in 1910. That seems a coincidence. -JLe

If he was a Carman, then 1911 that Tracy found is looking good!

Sorry Sharon that is the one i found...I'll post now.

Looks like Lizzie was working as a domestic and Thomas went home...

T x

EDIT:

1911 RG14PN6926 RG78PN343B RD128 SD4 ED59 SN48
Address: 156 High St New Brentford County: Middlesex
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JOHNSON, Samuel Head Married M 51 1860 Horse Dealer Middx Brentford
JOHNSON, Kate Wife Married 33 years F 50 1861 London Stepney
JOHNSON, Samuel Son Single M 32 1879 Carman Brentford
***JOHNSON, Thomas Son Married M 27 1884 Carman Brentford ***
JOHNSON, George Son Single M 23 1888 Assistant Dealer Brentford
JOHNSON, Matilda Daughter Single F 19 1892
JOHNSON, Kate Daughter Single F 16 1895
JOHNSON, Mary Daughter F 12 1899
JOHNSON, Charles M 10 1901

OK we have him and his parents....

I wonder where her parents are?

Could the children be with them?


Tracey x

I have the birth & death certificates, but do not have a marriage certificate or any other info. as to why from being born Thomas Johnson on birth certificate to Thomas Kershaw on the death certificate

If his birth was registered as Thomas Johnson, then maybe the Bertam was added when/if he was adopted?

Any idea what his sibling was called?

Sharon

Does the death cert alude to anything Johnson?

Does it give his parents details or anything?

The question is how do you know this Thomas Johnson is the same man? What actual evidence do you have (not just word of mouth)??

Tracey x

Lizzie Annie Maria James - 1888 - Ashford, Middx her father Charles Robert James - 1868 - Ross, Herefordshire - Mother Maria Susan Read - 1869 - Ashford, Middx - Siblings Charles R - 1887, George H - 1891, Rosa - 1894, Beatrice - 1900

Hi Sharon
I know that you have the birth cert, but what we were trying to ask was, how do you know that the birth cert is the correct one?-J

Bingo...got the other child!!!

posting in 2 mins....dosn't solve your issue, but i'd lay money one of her sister's/Aunts maybe has Thomas??

1911 RG14PN6915 RG78PN343B RD128 SD4 ED48 SN13
Address: 43 Layton Road Brentford County: Middlesex
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JAMES, Charles Head Married M 43 1868 House Painter Ross Herefordshire
JAMES, Maria Wife Married 24 years F 41 1870 Ashford Middlesex
JAMES, Rose Daughter Single F 17 1894 Mother's Help Rickmansworth Herts
JAMES, Lily Daughter F 7 1904 Brentford Middllesx
JAMES, Richard Son M 5 1906 Brentford Middllesex
JAMES, John Son M 4 1907 Brentford Middllesex
JAMES, Alice Daughter F 3 1908 Brentford Middllesex
JAMES, Ada Daughter F 1 1910 Brentford Middllesex
***JOHNSON, Florence Grandchild F 2 1909 Brentford Middllex

Tracey xx

EDIT:

The story for adoption is picking up speed, but it does scare me a little an assumption has been made about the name change....we def ought to investigate the other side of the facts that indeed the real Thomas Bertram Kershaw may just exist as he was and we're chasing our tails.

T x

Birth certificate and death certificate was given to me by my mother-in-laws sister she does not have any other info. and so I am trying to help them both.

I thank you all for your support in trying to find out the answer for me.

Sharon x

On the 1911 Rose, Lizzie's sister is a mother's help, i wonder if she worked at the workhouse??


Tracey x

Hi Sharon
Thanks for the reply. Could it be that the birth cert, given to you could be the wrong one. Is it a copy of an original? Could it be that someone previously had applied for a wrong cert, perhaps by mistake. Whilst it does seem a mystery the link between his possible birth in Brighton and your mother in law's birth in the same town still seems a possibility.-J

These are the only Thomas Bertram ? born in 1910 that come up so far:-

Births Mar 1910 (>99%)
ALGER Thomas Bertram St Olave 1d 230
BEDDOWS Thomas Bertram Chorlton 8c 880
CASTELOW Thomas Bertram Leeds 9b 865

Births Jun 1910 (>99%)
EVANS Thomas Bertram Kidderminster 6c 205
HILL Thomas Bertram Mansfield 7b 114
MITCHELL Thomas Bertram Steyning 2b 243
SELLEN Thomas Bertram F Sheppey 2a 1026
SMITH Thomas Bertram R Sculcoates 9d 188

Yes both certificates are copies, but mother-in-law is sure that this is his cetificate and remembers the surname Johnson being mentioned, could it be that he changed his name by deed poll because of the shame of being born in a work house or could one of his aunties married a Kershaw and he adopted the surname that way