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Thanks for that Flip.

Checked it out and I was a few years out:

"However, registration did not become compulsory until 1875. Until 1875 there was no penalty for not registering a birth; after that a fine of £2 was introduced."

So, she may not have been registered ... Brampton is/was a fairly rural insulated community.

No, there were no penalties for not registering births until sometime around 1878 I believe, before this it was voluntary - but I'm sure someome will en-lighten us further.

If you need the parish registers for Brampton checking I can try, but it'll be a week or so before I get the chance to get to the Carlisle archive centre.

Hi Flip I thought they had to be registered by then?
Gail

Neither of the 1858 Carlisle births may be Margaret Noble - if, as the 1861 census states she was born in Brampton then the birth should have been registered in the Brampton registration district. She may not have been registered.

Thank you all for your help, given me more to go on, I now need to find out who Margarets parents were, she says on her marriage cert that Thomas Noble a joiner was her father will have to take a chance and send for one of the two birth certs from 1858 and state Thomas as the father, if not right then send for the other.

Gail

Not a problem.
A second opinion is good.

Sorry, Mike, I didn't notice you had already posted that christening record.

Yes, that's the one I posted earlier.
I know it's not 1830 birth but you never know how accurate ages are.

How about this one then:

Name: Jane Bell
Gender: Female
Christening Date: 23 Nov 1828
Christening Place: Crosby-upon-Eden, Cumberland, England
Birth Date:
Father's Name: George Bell
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Margaret

Mike,

Thanks for you help. gives me some more to go on

Gail

Yes it's from the marriage cert

Yes that could be right.
Thanks for your help. Someone in canada who has contacted me has mentioned Croby as well but don't know where they got that from. sounds promising though

Gail

How do you know that Jane Bell's father was George? Is it off the marriage certificate?
If she was born in Brampton, t his seems to be the only possibility:

Name: Jane Bell
Gender: Female
Christening Date: 07 Mar 1830
Christening Place: Brampton, Cumberland, England
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: William Bell <<<<<<
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Mary Bell

That 1851 could be this Jane Bell born Crosby
Don't know if she yours



Name:
Jane Bell
Baptism Date:23 Nov 1828

Baptism Place:
Crosby Upon Eden,Cumberland,England

Father: George Bell
Mother: Margaret

Isabella Little, "England Marriages, 1538–1973 "
Name: Thomas Noble
Birth Date: 1837
Birthplace:
Age: 24
Spouse's Name: Isabella Little
Spouse's Birth Date: 1838
Spouse's Birthplace:
Spouse's Age: 23
Event Date: 19 Aug 1861
Event Place: Cathedral,Manchester,Lancashire,England
Father's Name:
Mother's Name:
Spouse's Father's Name:
Spouse's Mother's Name:
Race:
Marital Status:
Previous Wife's Name:
Spouse's Race:
Spouse's Marital Status:
Spouse's Previous Husband's Name:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M09789-5
System Origin: England-ODM
GS Film number: 438223, 438224, 438225, 438226, 438227, 438228

and the age of Jane would be about right as well

Hi Mike
That one from 1861 sounds promising as there is a Little on there and Thomas married a Isabella Little from Brampton in 1862 in Manchester.

Thanks Gail

Is this her .
If so, she'd already left home by 1851


1851

Jane Bell
Age:21

Estimated birth year:abt 1830

Relation:Servant

Where born:Crosby, Cumberland, England

Civil Parish:Brampton
Town:Brampton
County/Island:Cumberland


John Armstrong 35
Rachael Armstrong 36
William Armstrong 7
John Armstrong 5
Elisabeth Armstrong 3
Ann Armstrong 1
Jane Bell 21 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<

????

1861 Census
7 Records found



Piece: RG9/3918 Place: St Mary -Cumberland Enumeration District: 2
Civil Parish: St Mary Within Ecclesiastical Parish: Saint Mary
Folio: 32 Page: 3 Schedule: 11
Address: "Black Swan"

Surname First name(s) Rel Status Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
SCOTT George Head W M 72 Publican Empg 4 Servts Cumberland - Sebergham
HOLMES Ann Hsekpr U F 43 Housekeeper Cumberland - Abbey Lannercost
SIBSON Elizabeth Servnt U F 27 Barmaid Cumberland - Brampton
BELL Jane Servnt U F 29 Cook Cumberland - Brampton
LITTLE Hannah Servnt U F 20 Housemaid Cumberland - Penrith
GOWLING William Boardr U M 24 "Army" Cumberland - Culgaith
MATTHEWS Thomas Boardr U M 44 Organ Harmonm & Pianoforte Mkr West Riding of Yorkshire - Wakefield