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Re Alfred Frederick Rand, certainly the other brother, on the 1891 Uk census he was in a Dr Barnados home which would have been taken around April 1891 and the passage to Portland was in November 1891 and as I thought the children went from Portland to Canada. I wonder if Thomas Richard returned home to the Uk in 1903 to look for his brother Alfred

Hi AG. Feel unsure if Thomas Richard returned home, could it be the Thomas Henry born Beckenham Kent you mentioned because Thomas Richard was born in Gravesend Kent. Looking at the marriage of Thomas Richard Rand to Mabel Rose Boyd in 1903 I think the marriage split up because Mabel Rand/Boyd married a Thomas Vovig and on her death in 1948 she was down as Mabel Rose Vevig. Looking again at the voyage back to Vancouver in March 1903 , Thomas Richard Rand was stated as being a Labourer on,his marriage to Mabel so it could be possible it his him. But being a labourer would he have been able to have afforded a return voyage in those days.

[EDIT: Actually, this could equally well be the Thomas Henry Rand born in Beckenham in 1878, who travelled a lot to and from Canada.]


Re Thomas Richard's marriage to Mabel in Vancouver 1903 -

I wonder if this can be him returning from a visit to UK?
The image says he's a labourer, born in Kent, hading for Vancouver.


Canadian Passenger Lists, 1865-1935 about Thomas Rand
Name: Thomas Rand
Gender: Male
Age: 25
Estimated birth year: abt 1878
Date of Arrival: 9 Mar 1903
Vessel: Tunisian
Search Ship Database: View the 'Tunisian' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Port of Arrival: St John, New Brunswick via Halifax, Nova Scotia
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Roll: T-505

Item: A F RAND
Given Name(s):
A F
Surname:
RAND
Age:
10
Gender:
M
Ship:
SARDINIAN
Port of Departure:
Liverpool
Date of Departure:
1891-11-07
Port of Arrival:
Portland
Date of Arrival:
1891-11-17
Year of Arrival:
1891
Party:
Barnardo Homes
Destination:
Toronto, Ontario
Comments:
40 boys for Dr. Barnardo in Toronto who entered Canada at Montreal from Portland, Maine.
Type of Records:
Records of other organizations
Children travelling together:
Z91AA
Source:
Public Record Office
Reference:
BT27/64
Item Number:
98826


http://goo.gl/Q21iVT

England & Wales Christening Records, 1530-1906 about Thomas Richard Rand
Name: Thomas Richard Rand
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 10 Dec 1878
Christening Place: Milton near Gravesend, Kent, England
Father's Name: Richard John Rand
Mother's name: Eliza

Sorry John, but why do you think he was christened in October. The above record states December.



From your reply 29 Jun 2014 21:08


'The christening of Thomas was 10th October 1878 Gravesend and not 10th December 1878 as stated so the November birthday is debatable, but then he may have thought his birthday as being November perhaps didn't have a birth cert. '

Lots of children on the same sailing so this may be him

Print individual transcription View image
First name(s) A F
Last name RAND
Gender Male
Age 10
Birth year 1881
Occupation CHILD
Departure year 1891
Departure day 7
Departure month 11
Departure port LIVERPOOL
Destination port PORTLAND
Destination PORTLAND
Country United States
Destination country United States
Ship name SARDINIAN
Ship master's first name WM
Ship master's last name RICHARDSON
Shipping line ALLAN LINE
City LIVERPOOL
Ship destination port PORTLAND
Ship destination country USA
Ship square feet 4202
Ship registered tonnage 2577
Number of passengers 156
Record set Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960
Category Travel & migration
Record collection Passenger lists
Collections from Australasia, Great Britain, Ireland, United States


Kiddies didn't go to Canada until they were 10 or coming up to 10"

My mums elder half sister was a home child too in 1909. She went to the USA and then travelled to Canada from there

I don't think this can be Arthur Frederick because his parents were Richard John and Eliza Rand where on the marriage it states Albert and Martha Rand

His exact DOB will be on his birth certificate

Births Dec 1878 (>99%)
Rand Thomas Richard Gravesend 2a 457

I think this may be the marriage for the Arthur F that you found

Ontario, Canada, Marriages, 1801-1928
Name: Arthur Fred Rand
Birth Place: England
Age: 23
Estimated birth year: abt 1880
Father Name: Albert Rand
Mother Name: Martha Rand
Spouse Name: Catherine Graham
Spouse's Age: 24
Spouse Birth Year: abt 1879
Spouse Birth Place: Canada
Spouse Father Name: Robert John H Graham
Spouse Mother Name: Sarah Louisa Hibson
Marriage Date: 12 May 1903
Marriage County or District: York

ADDED: on the 1921 Canada census he says he arrived in Canada 1884 but on the 1916 census he says he arrived 1891 (same man as he's with wife Catherine and daughter Pearl on each)

Could one of you kind people find when the brother of Thomas Richard Rand, ie. Arthur Frederick Rand born 1881 Gravesend Kent UK also went to Canada for I found one in a census married to a Catherine with a daughter Pearl, states born at sea. I do not have Ancestry worldwide. Many thanks

Hello Alviegal. I feel the Thomas Rand sent to Toronto by Dr Barnadoes aboard the Vancouver in 1889 could be him and the marriage to Mabel Rose Boyd, although his father was Richard John Rand and not John Richard Rand but then names are sometimes down back to front. I wonder if he ever had further contact with his z2 siblings also put in homes or even with his 8 half siblings. I think it is dreadful what the staff of Dr Barnadoes did to the unfortunate children in their care by sending them abroad away from their kin. I know some made good but then others didn't. I was in an orphanage myself from 1947 until 1953 and was very fortunate I was not separated from my elder brother and we were not sent abroad. Just attended the yearly reunion with all from the orphanage and we are still like a family so feel very lucky to have this bond with them all.

The christening of Thomas was 10th October 1878 Gravesend and not 10th December 1878 as stated so the November birthday is debatable, but then he may have thought his birthday as being November perhaps didn't have a birth cert.

Hello Alviegal. I feel the Thomas Rand sent to Toronto by Dr Barnadoes aboard the Vancouver in 1889 could be him and the marriage to Mabel Rose Boyd, although his father was Richard John Rand and not John Richard Rand but then names are sometimes down back to front. I wonder if he ever had further contact with his z2 siblings also put in homes or even with his 8 half siblings. I think it is dreadful what the staff of Dr Barnadoes did to the unfortunate children in their care by sending them abroad away from their kin. I know some made good but then others didn't. I was in an orphanage myself from 1947 until 1953 and was very fortunate I was not separated from my elder brother and we were not sent abroad. Just attended the yearly reunion with all from the orphanage and we are still like a family so feel very lucky to have this bond with them all.

Oh just realised Thomas was sent to Toronto and not Vancouver, that was the name of the ship

1901 Census of Canada about Mabel Boyd
Name: Mabel Boyd
Gender: Female
Marital Status: Single
Age: 17
Birth Day & Month: 2 Apr
Birth Year: 1883
Birthplace: Ontario
Relation to Head of House: Daughter
Father's Name: Thomas Boyd
Mother's name: Margret Boyd
Racial or Tribal Origin: Irish
Nationality: Canadian
Religion: Methodist
Province: British Columbia
District: New Westminster
District Number: 2
Sub-District: Chilliwack
Sub-District Number: A-5
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Thomas Boyd 56
Margret Boyd 38
Mabel Boyd 17
Clarence Boyd 16
Clifford Boyd 14
Ernest Boyd 12
Jessie Boyd 9
Margret Boyd 2



1930 United States Federal Census about Mabel Vevig
Name: Mabel Vevig
Gender: Female
Birth Year: abt 1884
Birthplace: Canada
Race: White
Home in 1930: Cordova, Third Judicial District, Alaska Territory
Map of Home: View map
Marital Status: Married
Relation to Head of House: Wife
Spouse's Name: Tom Vevig
Father's Birthplace: Ireland
Mother's Birthplace: United States
Occupation:

Education:

Military service:

Rent/home value:

Age at first marriage:

Parents' birthplace:

View image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Tom Vevig 47
Mabel Vevig 46



Washington, Deaths, 1883-1960 about Mabel Rose Vevig
Name: Mabel Rose Vevig
[Mabel Rose Boyd]
Gender: Female
Birth Date: abt 1883
Death Date: 14 May 1948
Age at Death: 65
Death Location: Alderwood Manor, Snohomish, Washington
Father: Thomas Boyd
Mother: Margaret Larabe
Record Source: Washington State Death Records

??
http://goo.gl/lvmW1C


Groom Name:
RAND, THOMAS RICHARD
Bride Name:
BOYD, MABEL ROSE ZETTA
Date:
1903/11/12
Event Place:
VANCOUVER
Registration Number:
1903-09-049338
B.C. Archives Mfilm Number:
B11373
GSU Mfilm Number:
1983530
Event Type:
Marriage
Vital Stat Images(s):
004400857_00619.jpg

You can view the record which states he was English, a bartender and his father was John Richard.
She was 20 and her father was Thomas Boyd.



Groom Name:
VEVIG, THOMAS
Bride Name:
RAND, MABEL ROSE
Date:
1911/08/09
Event Place:
VANCOUVER
Registration Number:
1911-09-066569
B.C. Archives Mfilm Number:
B11376
GSU Mfilm Number:
1983704
Event Type:
Marriage
Vital Stat Images(s):
004401575_00406.jpg

This appears to be a second marriage for Mabel but states she was a spinster, 28. Her father is Thomas Boyd Rand.
This does not make sense if it is her.

??


Item: Thomas RAND
Given Name(s):
Thomas
Surname:
RAND
Gender:
M
Ship:
VANCOUVER
Port of Departure:
Liverpool
Date of Departure:
1889-06-13
Port of Arrival:
Quebec
Date of Arrival:
1889-06-23
Year of Arrival:
1889
Party:
Barnardo Homes
Destination:
Toronto, Ontario
Comments:
123 children most over 12 or ages not listed, Dr. Barnardos to Toronto.
Type of Records:
Passenger Lists
Microfilm Reel Number:
C-4537
Remarks:
The child's age was illegible, difficult to decipher or not given
Children travelling together:
Q89AW
Source:
Library and Archives Canada
Reference:
RG 76 C1a
Item Number:
30180

http://goo.gl/0cKiYY


If his birthday was in November then surely December 10th as a christening date is very possible.

Meant to say thank you all for the look ups.

Hello AG ,pleased to hear from you again. You helped me find the family of one of my Dads crew, all killed in 1943 Holland. In contact with the Heath family in Australia and they are over the moon. Regarding Thomas Richard Rand, having looked at what has been sent I really do not know what to think, his christening was 10th Dec 1878 yet on the Canadian 1901 census ,his birthday down as 19th Nov 1878 so presume it is not him. Obviously the 3 children of the 2nd marriage were all sent to a home.in the 1891 Canadian census re the Dr Barnados boy states he was 15 but Thomas would only have been 12 but then dates are not always correct so it could be him, if his father died in 1888, mother in 1883, he could have been in Dr Barnados for a couple of years before sent to Canada hence why not on the 1891 UK census and his younger brother Arthur too young to be sent out to work. Found no death for him in the UK.

The same user has added this note to this 1901 record:

Thomas R Rand rather than Thomas B Rand
Correction due to an error in transcription.
Submitted by janthompson258 on 12/09/2012


1901 Census of Canada about Thomas B Rand
Name: Thomas B Rand
[Thomas R Rand]
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Single
Age: 22
Birth Day & Month: 19 Nov
Birth Year: 1878
Birthplace: England
Relation to Head of House: Lodger
Immigration Year: 1898
Racial or Tribal Origin: English
Nationality: Canadian
Religion: Church Of England
Occupation: Labourer
Province: British Columbia
District: Yale & Cariboo
District Number: 5
Sub-District: Kootenay (West/Ouest), (Revelstoke Riding/Division Revelstoke)
Sub-District Number: G-1
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Donald Bain 38
Susan Bain 40
Donald Bain 10
Wilburn F Clary 32
John Mctavish 30
Thomas B Rand 22
John W Crawford 31
William Mcgill 52
James Noble 59
Jacob Noll 21
Andrew A Johnson 30
Lionel Wilcox 22
Lionel Thompson 36
James Mainland 44
Thomas Mcguin 25
William Mathews 39
Toy Wong 25