Find Ancestors

well I think what that first part tells us ... is that in the case of the father of Rhoda Barnett, the surname indeed did vary between Barnard and Barnett

and the second list tells us that 'our' Rhoda Barnard who married Knight also had a variable surname, since she was Barnett on one of her children's birth records

so at least I got that bit right anyway!

but 'our' Rhoda Barnard doesn't seem to be the daughter of James Barnard and Ann Morgan

... unless she was enumerated in two places in 1871 which is not impossible

... because, on the other hand, Rhoda daughter of James doesn't seem to have married or died under either surname, and in 1881 there is just the one Rhoda Barnard in Gloucestershire ...

so if that Rhoda is 'our' Rhoda, what is the relationship with the Proberts??

Ann Morgan doesn't seem to have been previously Probert

Using links at http://www.ukbmd.org.uk/local_bmd

Groom Surname Groom Forename Bride Surname Bride Forename District Parish Building Year Register Entry
BARNARD James MORGAN Ann Forest of Dean Drybrook Holy Trinity 1852 1 114
KNIGHT William BARNARD Rhoda Forest of Dean Cinderford St John the Evangelist 1885 2 390

Child Surname Child Forename Father Surname Mother Surname Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
BARNARD Sarah Ann BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1853 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 13 206
BARNARD Jonathan James BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1854 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 15 78
BARNARD Male BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1856 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 16 214
BARNARD Alfred BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1858 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 18 430
BARNETT Emily BARNETT BARNETT MORGAN 1861 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 22 29
BARNETT Eliza BARNETT BARNETT MORGAN 1863 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 23 379
** BARNETT Rhoda BARNETT BARNETT MORGAN 1865 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 25 439
BARNARD George BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1867 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 27 485
BARNARD Elizabeth Ann BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1868 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 29 393
BARNARD William BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1870 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 31 490
BARNARD Thomas BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1871 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 33 90
BARNARD Frederick Charles BARNARD BARNARD MORGAN 1873 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 35 433
------------
KNIGHT Leonard James KNIGHT KNIGHT BARNARD 1887 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 55 473
KNIGHT Charles Ivor KNIGHT KNIGHT BARNETT 1890 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 59 477
KNIGHT Elsie KNIGHT KNIGHT BARNARD 1892 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 63 72
KNIGHT William Edwin KNIGHT KNIGHT BARNARD 1894 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, East Dean 2 74
KNIGHT Simeon Frank KNIGHT KNIGHT BARNARD 1896 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, East Dean 4 435

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years:
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name Reference
1898 KNIGHT Olive Atherton Wigan & Leigh BARNARD ATH/82/51
1900 KNIGHT Emily Atherton Wigan & Leigh BARNARD ATH/86/95
1902 KNIGHT Lily Atherton Wigan & Leigh BARNARD ATH/89/196
1905 KNIGHT Reuben Atherton Wigan & Leigh BARNARD ATH/96/384
1908 KNIGHT Jonathan Atherton Wigan & Leigh BARNARD ATH/102/184

You're welcome Zoe. I'm off to bed now.

Good hunting.

Kath. x

Thank you for all of your help!

I agree Joonie.

Kath. x

I'd get your marriage certificate, I think that's the best suggestion here and only good way to start!

Child Surname Child Forename Father Surname Mother Surname Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
BARNARD Rhoda BARNARD BARNARD DIXON 1872 Forest of Dean Westbury on Severn, Newnham 35 110

I found this one on Forest of Dean site but can't find it on FreeBMD but obviously the date wouldn't work.. I don't think I'm making any sense anymore.. sigh.. might be time for bed!

Don't want to confuse things any more than they already are but just wondered if this birth may be a possibility - but it would mean the surname was misheard again, but bearing in mind we think the mother's name may be Elizabeth (and Rhoda was probably born before her mother's marriage):-

First name(s) ELIZABETH RHODA
Last name ROBERTS
Birth year 1865
Birth quarter 1
Registration month -
Mother's last name -
District WESTBURY ON SEVERN
County Gloucestershire
Country England
Volume 6A
Page 212

Just one to think about really.

Kath. x

Lol.. This ones proving particularly difficult!

What 'Ancestry', Zoe ... somebody's tree or an actual record?

oops I see, 1871 census, hm, darn ...

I think you will need to buy Rhoda's marriage certificate to see whether or not she names a father.

Kath. x

Rhoda Barnett born 1865 in Westbury on Severn.. Ancestry suggests she is daughter of James and Ann Barnett in 1871 census.. so don't think that is her

Tom might be one of these

Births Jun 1843
BARNARD Thomas Westbury Severn 11 468

Births Sep 1843
BARNARD Thomas Westbury on S. 11 464

well, except that they likely both died that same year

no wait ... one of the deaths is in Mar quarter so that would have been a bit precipitous!

but can't find in the 1851 or 1861 census

there are also Thomas Barnard deaths in 48, 48 and 50

and there is a Thomas Barnett birth ... and death ... in Westbury in 1844 ...


editing again to add (Monmouth reg dist covers Newland)

Births Dec 1846
Probert Elizabeth Monmouth 26 81



does help when you catch up and see that somebody has already posted the census you needed for your suggestion (daughter Elizabeth in 1861) :-)

It is indeed getting late, lol, but it's nice to see quite a few people working on one thread - doesn't happen too much lately on here, at least not as much as in the old days (about 10 years ago, lol).

Kath.x

Yes Kathleen, it's getting late (laughs) - see my EDIT which I did before I saw your post

much leapfrogging :-D

I've been looking for the parents after the marriage, but knowing nothing about Tom's personal info makes it difficult, because the most likely scenario may be that Elizabeth died

Thank you Greyghost

Greyghost - I think JoonieCloonie may possibly have already found the correct birth and marriage for the parents.

Kath. x

This census shows her as born Cinderford. Plump (birthplace as per 1891 census) is about ½ way between Mitcheldean and Cinderford.

1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Abbey Street, Flaxley, Westbury on Severn, Gloucestershire, England

First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Gender Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Thomas Probert Head - Male 56 1815 - Gloucestershire, England
Mary Probert Wife - Female 55 1816 - Gloucestershire, England
Harry Probert Son - Male 18 1853 - Gloucestershire, England
Eliza Probert Daughter - Female 17 1854 - Gloucestershire, England
Rhoda Barnard Granddaughter - Female 6 1865 - Gloucestershire, England
William Blewett Lodger - Male 20 1851 - Gloucestershire, England
Jesse Parker Lodger - Male 22 1849 - Gloucestershire, England

For her to be granddaughter, the easiest explanation would be that a female Probert had married a male Barnard. The only one I can see is in 1841 in Crickhowell, Breconshire, Wales so couldn't be a daughter of Thomas and Mary.

She may have not been registered, there were no penalties for not doing so until the 1870's

EDIT - well late with this offering, reminds me to refresh before posting, but at least have had the same thoughts as others.

In the 1861 census the grandparents DO have a daughter called Elizabeth, so I would say that is a good possibility Joonie.

Kath. x