General Chat

There are many more schools than posted above:

http://sites.cardiff.gov.uk/ysgol/Schools/SchoolSearch/DoSchoolSearch.asp?School_type=s

I'll await the flak for this, however it's my opinion......when schools were categorised as: Grammar, Technical College and Secondary Modern in the 50s and 60s every child, no matter what their ability, could access the education which would suit them best.

Today's system has disadvantaged both the more academic and the less academic. It's been a nightmare for some friends teaching math and science to a classroom of mixed ability pupils.

Too little time given to those who could progress quickly as too much time given to those who are having problems keeping up.

There is nothing more damaging to a child than making them feel inadequate in a class where they are being taught a subject they cannot grasp and at a level they will never use as an adult.

We all know how difficult it can be to understand any subject if we didn't have a good founding in the basics. Some children don't have the capacity to absorb academically but they may well be mechanical, artistic or inventive.

The system needs a good shake up but having said that, it's had so many in the past that I doubt a final solution will ever be set in stone.

Let's give EVERY child the opportunity to be the best they can in whatever career choice they make.

According to the latest annual stats, Whitchurch High is indeed extremely poor performing and in need of desperate improvement.

It is in the absolute bottom tier of schools and is accompanied by an astonishing 16 ( ! ) schools in total across Cardiff.

Michaelston Community College in Cardiff is the eighth worst secondary school in Wales out of a total of 220 odd - that's pretty bad.

well I hope you find the programme enjoyable and amusing

Interesting thread :-)

I prefer something with a bit more substance - I am not a big fan of these staged documentaries - but I am sure there are those who will find it entertaining and amusing.

Well the education provided in general does afford them better jobs than serving behind a bar. Not that there's anything wrong with 20 somethings doing that as they get a great social life.

:-D :-D :-D

The trouble with the old system of grammar/High schools was that entryw as gained by taking the 'scholarship'( in my time), then the eleven plus. I passed, for some reason I believe extra points were awarded for those taking it under a certain age. I went to High school when I had been eleven years old for less than a month. Too young. I had been bright and done well at primary. I didn't thrive at High school, I was too young to keep up with those older than me, (I was also young for my age, a mouse, timid) I invariably slipped under the radar. I obtained two O levels. (Pass or fail in my day). After I left school, later on, in my 20s/30s I took and passed three more O levels and two A levels (One at grade A) and one economics GCSE. High school/grammar schools don't suit everyone. It would have been far better for me if I had gone to secondary school and been taught shorthand typing.

Both our children went to comprehensive schools, both did well at O level/'GCSE and A level. Neither chose to go to Uni. Both have always been in work (in their 50s/late 40s now). Son has a high powered job in life insurance with 500 people working for him, daughter has taken retirement but is contracting, also for life insurance and she has done equally well. Both had good, bad and indifferent teachers but both worked hard. sometimes it is not the school but the parents who have not, from an early age, instilled a work ethic in them.

I am not quite sure what it has to do with barwork and whether you are making reference to just Cardiff (there are an awful lot of bars there - some quite good with highly qualified staff), but I would be very interested indeed to see the stats you are basing this on - should make fascinating reading and comparison.
Do the stats break down by area or just generally across Wales?

sadly there are a lot of bars in every big city and every bar needs bar staff - usually youngsters making a bob or two towards their uni fees - others work behind bars because that's the only occupation they are suited to, or the only job they can get

how you can describe Educating Cardiff as being entertaining and amusing I cannot fathom - how could anyone with any values at all take pleasure in seeing kids being failed in school

No Errol I am not referring to Cardiff at all :-D

Sadly a lot of people spout on about areas they know nothing about other than reading dry (out of date) statistics which do not represent the reality.

I wouldn't dream of voicing an opinion on any other great city (apart from London) because my knowledge would be lacking and probably skewed by media reports.

Of course it will be entertaining - that is the whole point of "shows" like this - and it will have more than its fair share of amusing scenes.

I have not seen any previews of the new series so I cannot say that it is a programme about "kids being failed in school".
Is that what it is about?

"others work behind bars because that's the only occupation they are suited to, or the only job they can get" - what a very dim and insulting view you have of a group of (usually) professionals who work extremely hard and I have a great deal of admiration for.

I wonder if there is a connection between education standards in Cardiff and the fact that it is the crime hotspot of Wales.

Of the top 20 crime hotspot post codes in Wales, an astonishing 15 are in Cardiff.

It also has the dubious boast of being home to the post code with the highest number of violent and sexual offences.

EDIT I totally agree supercrutch - I would never comment on a place or topic I know absolutely nothing about. Nor would I base it on dry or out of date statistics.

Sue our second Grandson went to Uni, opted out of the teaching career he was set on at first in the second year (I haven't a clue what his degree is in). He is working in the Lakeland restaurant in the Lake District, he couldn't find any other work. However, within 18 months he is now a supervisor and he enjoys his job so that must count for something I suppose.

in that case we can rest easy in the knowledge you will never be visiting then

supercrutch ...........

I do wholeheartedly agree with your post of 16:07

I went to a Grammar School in a Lancashire mill town in the 1950s ............... yes, we had to pass the 11 plus, and yes, we were coached in how to pass that exam!

The school then sorted its students into 4 levels. I disgusted the Deputy Headmistress because I had been put into the A stream, didn't do as well as expected so was dropped into the B stream at the end of the first year .............. and I was happy about it instead of being upset! She didn't know that the I did not want to do the Latin that A streamers had to do from 2nd year on, and was very happy to do the German that we did in the B and C streams.

Then there was also the 13+ exam for the late developers who had failed the 11+ and gone to the Secondary School ......... I think that came in during the late 1950s or early 1960s.

I'm not sure what happened to AnnG ............... both the school I went to and the school where I taught in the mid-1960s had a D stream, where the girls did cookery, sewing, art, bookkeeping and shorthand typing, as well as French, English, Math, and a science. The boys could do woodwork, metal work, and art, and the academic subjects. The Northern Universities Board had exams in the "non-academic" subjects, and I know several girls who graduated from my school with GCEs in shorthand and typing and went straight into well-paying jobs at the age of 16.

It seems to me that there is more forcing a child into a mould these days than there was back then.

Re working in bars and restaurants ..........

............. for a professional, willing to work at their "trade" and become truly "professional", these can be amongst the most high-paying jobs over here, when you add tips to the base salary.

I do note that such jobs fit into minimum wage categories in this country, which I know does not apply everywhere.

I won't be watching, I hate that type of reality programme.

Reading the last few posts I wonder if we (teachers) are raising children's expectations unrealistically. Are we teaching them that working in a fast food place, supermarket or a pub isn't a "proper" job?

I worked in all three in my school/student days and didn't particularly enjoy the experience so that made me a bit more determined to get the A levels I needed.

However, I know plenty of people with jobs in supermarkets etc and they are very happy working there. Good friends and customer discount!

Not everyone is cut out for a job requiring "brainwork". Some people's skills lie elsewhere and some are happy with a mundane job that pays the bills.

Some people, like Ann's grandson find their niches in surprising places and do very well, turning a job into a career.

The emphasis on tests and exams currently forced onto schools may make some children feel inadequate.

AnnG .............


re your experience being the youngest in the class ...........

My brother would have been in your shoes. His birthday was in August, the Junior School entered him for the 11+ when he was only 10 but told him he would have a second chance the following year if he failed. He did no work for the exam, so failed ................ then the school forgot to enter him for the exam the following year.

So, he had to stay at the secondary school, which in his case was part of the CofE Church School that we both attended from Infants on.

He left school at the age of 14 in 1943, later told me he walked the streets for about 6 weeks before getting a job as an apprentice draughtsman. He married at the age of 21, had 2 children by 23, and was STILL attending Night School to get all the qualifications he could. He became a top-flight draughtsman who commanded a very high salary.

He was brighter than I was, but his experience made me work hard.

Oh I have nothing but respect for dedicated people who choose a career in catering, after all I managed the conferences and functions at a 75 bed hotel for 9 years. Competent and friendly staff can make all the difference to a guest's experience.

It's also jolly hard work and long hours plus your cheeks ache after smiling at people for many hours.

There is a difference between catering as a career choice and 'just a job'.

BTW I attended an all girls Grammar, I don't know whether I missed out...lolol

mine was an all girls grammar school as well

I'm afraid that I was rather horrified to hear that there was such a TV programme

............... I don't think even the US with its huge reliance on Reality TV has yet exploited children in school .......

....... and exploitation is what Reality TV is all about.

I wonder how much the school, the Cardiff Education Board, the Principal, the teachers and the children were paid?

I wonder how much effect the programme will have on the children in future years when they try to get jobs, and some one Googles them and says "Oh YOU were in THAT show".

If they gave a good showing then fine, if not ............. that could mean a lost job.