General Chat

Advocating sexual assault is not something one can be unbiased about. Neither is saying women should be punished for having abortions. I doubt any teacher would feel comfortable defending either, I know I wouldn't.

I would be furious with any teacher who tried to tell a child of mine that those things are ok.

rich men fiddling their income returns moving into social housing vacated by black families no wonder there is a housing crisis
:-0

I'm sorry did I say I did think those things were acceptable ??
I think you're taking me way too literally !
I think you can find good in everyone it just takes an awful lot more looking for some.

That said....there are many people in America amongst other places, that do hold those views Guinevere so Trump was saying what they wanted to hear.....do I think it's right no of course not.

But today of all days we should be grateful that we all live in free countries where even the misinformed can hold their views.

Ah there you are Rollo ! :-)

This is what you said, Caroline

"Teachers/parents whomever should have been giving examples of good and bad for all sides not just putting one person down........even though it's tempting to instill our own strongly held views on our kids."

I disagree that teachers should be expected to find any "good" in the two cases I outlined. There are others just as indefensible. Just because some citizens are racist, misogynistic and homophobic doesn't mean that teachers are obliged to give credence to their abhorrent views. They aren't and they shouldn't be.

"He can have nothing to do with any of his businesses when he becomes President."

not so easy as he may be answering charges of criminal fraud re Trump University during 2017.

thanks to changes made by the Republicans when they were after Bill Clinton beng a sitting president is no longer any protection.

I'm neither supporting nor recommending those things Guinevere, nor am I saying there is any good in those examples.
I said there is some good in everyone not that those situations were good.
If you can't teach children to recognize there are good and bad points/sides then you are just spoon feeding your own views, again though that's not to be taken so literally that I think Hitler was a great guy for instances but if nothing else it helps to explain how Europe has to be aware of it's History.....people were feeling down trodden and had a depression they listened to the person that said what they wanted to hear........plus side Churchill was a great speaker and managed to say what was needed to get Britain through it's darkest hours.

And to some of your points Guinevere the Catholic church and schools whilst not saying you should be punished per sa will not teach the children that abortion is good....also there are many extreme religious groups in America who will say Woman are second class citizens and are there for their husbands pleasure...these people voted don't forget.

Talking to the children about policy difference between political parties is what our job is. Explaining historical events in context is our job.

But there are some absolute evils, like the holocaust, and it's our job to condemn them.

Our job ?? as parents ??

To my point though teachers have not given a balanced view and have just pushed in this instance for Clinton.

Sorry, Caroline ..............

I think that ANY teacher worth their salt should have been telling children that "our" way of life and beliefs do not include sexism, racism, the belief that any man can do whet he wants to a woman, that making derogatory remarks to women, LGBTQ, people of other races or religions, etc etc

To do otherwise would have left children believing that it is right to do those things.

Everything that Trump was saying on those lines was completely against anything that Canada has fought for over many many years .............. and I hope that that also applies to the majority of Americans.



As regards what you said to me .........

........ I've seen too many interviews over the years with men in their 50s and 60s who did leave school before graduation to start work. The common comment from them was "why stay in school when I could be earning?". That was the prevailing attitude from the 1940s through to the 1980s or 90s.

Then of course they are lost when those jobs disappear because they cannot find other work.

You only have to read stories in National Geographic or other magazines on the plight of Detroit, Pennsylvania, etc etc to know that.

Why should the teachers have said that Clinton was wrong .......

....... she never said or promoted any of the things that we are castigating Trump about? So what was wrong?

The political aspects and differences between Republican and Democrat surely are open for discussion in Social History or Political History classes. And that would have been difficult because trump never actually came out with any policy statements!

So far as I know, Clinton never said anything that was against normal ordinary common sense ................


Abortion is a matter of personal choice, and I truly hope that Roe vs Wade is not re-visited.

One person may not approve of it, but please don't force another person not to have one if they feel that is their only option.

Back street abortions are not wanted any more!

You haven't been able to get jobs in any of those fields without a High school diploma for many many years, mainly because they have more than enough people they pick and choose and who wouldn't take the higher educated ones.

Of course they would say this is the right thing to do but they should also have been explaining why some would not hold those views/have misplaced values they have not.

And as already stated yes most Americans don't hold those views but some do....but most voted for him despite those views he holds....that says something about the state of that country.

Again I'm not saying it is right......I'm not against abortions.

Clinton has many problems of her own when did I say she had similar problems.

For the record as plain as I can state it, I think they were both unworthy but "Lord" knows who would have been a better candidate !

My job, then, as a teacher. Also as a parent in my case but I realise that there are some awful people out there who will try to teach their children their repellent views.

A teacher's job is to make sure they see that isn't the only view.

Trump has spouted some disgracefully racist and misogynistic views. Hillary hasn't.

First port of call when teaching children - parents. Get in first because as they get older they'll hear a variety of views on subjects and they are YOUR children.

Not all teachers think the same as you, nor all parents such is life.

Again I go back to how much is Trump just telling people what they want to hear...no I don't think he's an angel really.

Hillary...is no angel either though for different reasons. And lets not forget her husband whilst she's not accountable for his actions she's stood by him with no regrets. And what was that comment she made about his supporters.....

Right as lovely as it is to knock my head against the wall here I'm off out for a few hours not off licking any wounds.....

I think we can agree to disagree for now.... :-)

*Not all teachers think the same as you*

I've yet to meet one who condones sexual assault, misogyny, homophobia or is a holocaust denier.

Guinevere ............... same here!

and that applies both when I was teaching back in the mid-1960s when it was part of my job as a Biology teacher to explain such things to the things and explain that they did not have to subject themselves to such treatments.

It also applied when my daughter was in school over here, and her teachers were dong the same thing.


JoyL ..... the idea of the parents as port of call in being the first teaching is fine. Except many parents do not do that.

When I was teaching, the parents received notice that their daughter would be receiving education on such-and-such a topic in 2 weeks time. If they did not want the information to come from us, then would they please ensure that they had taught their daughters beforehand.

Very few did ....... most were only too happy to delegate the task to us.


Plus you have the ones who are the red-necks who were a large part of Trump's supporters, who do teach their children that everything that we abhor is good and the correct thing to do.

What do you do about them?

The term redneck is a derogatory term chiefly used for a rural poor white person of the Southern United States.[1][2] Its usage is similar in meaning to cracker (especially regarding Georgia and Florida), hillbilly (especially regarding Appalachia and the Ozarks),[3] and white trash (but without the last term's suggestions of immorality).[4][5][6]

By the 1970s, the term had become offensive slang, and its meaning had expanded to mean bigoted, loutish, and opposed to modern ways.[7]

Patrick Huber has emphasized the theme of masculinity in the continued expansion of the term in the 20th century, noting, "The redneck has been stereotyped in the media and popular culture as a poor, dirty, uneducated, and racist Southern white man."[8].

for anyone who hasnt heard or know what is referd to as a redneck.